Elise/Exige project with ferrari 355 engine

Staggering. Really enjoying keeping up to date.

You could save a few more grams if you grind off the dancing donkey :mrgreen:

Is that a euphemism? :open_mouth:

I take it you have four legged pole dancers in Thailand Roberto? Anyway, that would be bump & grind would it not :ugeek:

On a hub dyno at Tracktive tomorrow afternoon and all day Wednesday. Wish me luck!!

Good luck! :slight_smile:

Keep us up to date with results/pics/vids.

Real shame you missed out on being at Anglesey, you missed a great day. Any view on when/where you’ll be ready to give it a proper shakedown?

Good luck Pat.

Well I’ll open by saying that this project might be over. I might break the car. I’m really struggling with the concept of where to draw a line between ploughing time and money into something that could provide me and my friends with something to experience and enjoy that is really unique, sounds great, and could be a very competitive car with the right development - - against - - something that requires money, effort, and development with seemingly no end, something that everytime it breaks kicks you in the stomach knowing that you just lost another XX weeks lying on a concrete floor taking it apart again, in order to fit some new hideously expensive part in the hope that “this will the be last thing to go wrong”.

Alternatively I could cash out now, while most of the bits are still brand new and get enough cash back to buy something that I can actually enjoy using this summer!

\

Rewind back to yesterday morning.
Picked the trailer up early doors and with the judicious use of wood got it onto the trailer without too much splitter dinging.

Took the car without any rear bodywork, and with the straight-through exhaust I mentioned before (which dimensionally replicates the silencer internals minus perf). Managed to get lucky to avoid the current spring showers on both journeys as I took it with no rear cover on at all!! (great way to get stares on the M1!!! anyone see me? :smiley: )

Got to Tracktive early afternoon and initial set up was not looking promising. Bearing in mind that as you all know this was an engine I had already had starting, idling and running upto temperature before the shaft failure. Well, it appears that having taken so much inertia out of the flywheel/clutch we were having big trouble getting reliable sync from Crank and Cam sensors due to the Crankspeed fluctuating a lot more during cranking, not helped by the Ferrari having a 60-2 trigger wheel where a fewer number of teeth with bigger gaps would have been beneficial.

We called it a day at 8pm on Tuesday with no joy and looking at the prospect of having to do something drastic like take a pnuematic die grinder to the trigger wheel (which looked do-able but painstaking without taking the engine out) or going back to a standard flywheel assy (I’d already sold mine). We also left an outstanding call with Cosworth/Pectel regarding crank filtering and some of the CalTool options but not optimistic to hear anything back during my 2 day window.

Onto today, we started at 8.30am the this morning and by 11.00 we hadn’t made any real progress. Then we pulled all the plugs which were sooty and wet from the repeated cranking and blowtorched them till the tips were glowing white. Refitted them whilst they were still as hot as we dared and tried again and we got a stutter. Added a bit of fuel and the stutter became a murmer, added a whole heap more fuel and whump, she came back into life :slight_smile:

Next we got the widebands in, and spent a half hour carefully balancing all 8 throttle bodies. Engine was coming upto temperature, and apart from some oil coming out of the dry sump tank breather we couldn’t see any issues. I thought the oil coming out the tank was probably the system just finding it’s level, but Richard was concerned it was gross carryover, so we ran the additional hose into the empty titan oil tank pictured so we could keep an eye on it. Luckily I was right and we never saw another single drop into the tank. :slight_smile:

At this stage Richard was happy to fit the car upto the hub dyno and we were both feeling pretty positive, Richard optimistic he might be able to get the car 90% mapped by close of the day.

Fitted it up and began actually driving the wheels since the first time the car has been built, but after only maybe 3 minutes of hub work, and below 2000rpm and 5% throttle Richard lifted the clutch and nothing happened. Shaft broken again! This time it’s a brand new one from Ferrari.

It’s got to be a harmonic issue. The first broke at no load on idle, this (brand new) one at about 4% throttle 1800rpm. Ferrari do have a problem with it if you search forums there are failures, but on the otherhand there are F355 Challenge cars and massive track mile “experience day” cars that are working fine. I’ve now tried standard dual mass flywheel with solid clutch, and single mass flywheel with nicely sprung centre clutch but still no joy. It’s such a shame because everything else ‘potentially problematic’ I have done (alternator sizing/mounting, driveshafts, closed loop fuel pump control, oil circuit, dry sump tank, air filtration…) seemed to be working well!

So 48 hours of highs and lows. Ending with me feeling pretty darn down this evening. Everyone who has seen the car in person has complemented me on it. And I feel justifiably proud of what I have achieved so far, 90% single-handedly and in a single garage within 2 years. But as I alluded to at the start, I’m not confident there is an end to the engineering tribulations, I’m severely lacking the motivation to pull the 'box off again to look at the damage and I’m thinking about cutting my losses and actually having some fun instead.


Sorry for the essay!
cheers
Patrick

That is such a shame Pat. It must be gutting for you after all the hard work you have put in. But please please persevere with it!

You’ve run a tough marathon, you’ve hit the wall a few times,…but you’ve tripped up on the final mile. Don’t give up now Pat!

Owning an engine converted car requires a particular mindset. Building such a car yourself and pushing the envelope in a totally unprecedented way requires a special kind of mentalist. You are that man, don’t give up, it will be worth it in the end.

If there was any way I could lend a hand I would be offering it but trust me I’m worse than useless.

You are not alone!
There are a few of us that have thrown the kitchen sink at builds and not got where we wanted to. I nearly sold my project last week though have decided not too, but then i’m probably 99% finished. From my own experience i know what kind of money it must be costing you, even if you’re in the trade, and i certainly wouldn’t blame you for taking the brave decision to break it, although like everyone else i’d love to see you finish it, its an awesome build.
However, watching a load of exiges flying round Anglesey on a sunny Exiges.com day whilst you’re watching from the paddock due to another failure is no place to be and a reasonably spec’d car can be had for about half the parts on show in the photos above!
Best of luck Pat, your call and only yours.

Chin up, pal. We’re all rooting for you. I can’t comprehend or deal with the technical problems you have suffered.
You’ve got so far so keep going. You can’t be far off although it must seem like you still have a mountain to climb. When it’s done you’ll be so chuffed. Stick with it!

Sorry to hear Pat, have to agree it’s something only you can decide. I broke my rather unique and expensive S2 build end of 2014 after I blew the engine. I had also bought an S1 earlier that year with an eye to restore it at some point. In between times I almost sold the S1 but I’m glad I didn’t. I’d spent a lot of money over the years on my S2 after buying it for £25,500 but I broke it without an engine and made just under £25k. I could have got more, I just got lazy and sick of packing boxes and visiting the post office. After a little period of reflection I started on the S1 and now all is well, mojo back! I think you have to know where to draw the line. On the bright side their is always something else you can happily work on. I couldn’t of spent anymore on the S2, I was done. I kind of joke with myself that not only can I completely ruin a perfectly good car but I can actually do a good job restoring one. Forums are full of us folk, as Chris said you are defiantly not alone. Good luck with what you decide, either way I’m behind you.

Well said John.

Who was the Kiwi who had a terrible time restoring his S1? He also never gave in and ended with one of the best S1 on the planet :wink: Keep your chin up, it will be worth it in the end :smiley:

car looks epic, love the hybrid VX front S1 arse end

I dunno, walk away for a bit and circle back around.

circled back through the thread, ooofhh it’s a beaut

George, sign on was Esprit

Thanks for all the words of encouragement. It means a lot to know that so many people are rooting for me. Having heard the car (albeit briefly) I would feel rude not to make it available for others to hear too!

Having taken a few days to take stock, I’m focusing on the positives from the rolling road session. In hindsight there were so many things that could have gone more badly wrong than this driveline issue. My fuel system, cooling system, alternator mounting and oil system were all un-proven and so it is good to get at least a reasonable level of confidence behind these going forward.

I’m going to take the broken parts for analysis this week and find out what they’re made from. In the meantime consider all the other aspects of how to ensure this issues doesn’t re-occur.

thanks again everyone who commented
Patrick

That’s good to hear Pat.
Sometimes you do need to take a step back and not make any spur of the moment decisions. I look forward to seeing yet more progress; the finish line will soon be in sight sir :slight_smile: