SELOC Speed Championship

General General Lotus Talk
1

Back in March/April time I posted on here about trying to establish a single make sprint series for our cars and I thought it’d be best to give you an update. Hopefully if you frequent SELOC you’ll already know a bit about this already.

Plans for a SELOC Speed Championship are continuing but as things are moving further towards getting finalised I need input to make sure we get a series that people will enjoy and support.

A discussion thread is taking place here:
http://forums.seloc.org/t/317305

And the latest draft of the regs can be found on page 4 of the thread or for download:
>>>> DOWNLOAD FROM HERE <<<<


Proposed events for qualifying rounds are as follows - note they show 2011 dates unless stated shown with a 2012 date in order to give you an idea of when in the year they fall. Events in bold are already confirmed.

13th March - North Weald - Borough 19
31st March 2012 - Castle Combe - Great Western Sprint - Bristol MC
28th April 2012 - Goodwood - Bognor Regis MC
29th May - Snetterton - Borough 19
11th June - Abingdon - CARnival - Sutton & Cheam MC (2 sprints in 1 day)
23rd June 2012 - Castle Combe - Dick Mayo - Bristol MC
07th Aug - Hethel - Borough 19
13th Aug - Curborough - BARC Midlands
10th Sept - Brands Hatch - Tunbridge Wells MC

Be aware that these are already established events organised by other motor clubs and as such I can’t organise trackdays or extra time at the venues.

Please have a look through the regs and let me know what you think, preferably in the discussion thread on SELOC.

The full details are in the regs but basic premise is splitting cars into 3 categories:
1)Normally aspirated factory
2)Forced induction factory
3)Engine converted cars and invited cars (i.e. non lotus)

A handicap factor will be applied to results based on a cars power to weight ratio in order to give a leveler playing field and points will then be scored on these adjusted results.

A competitors best eight scores of the season will count towards their final score.

Hope this all makes sense and it is what people are after.

Looking forward to your feedback.

Keith.

2

ooo interesting

3

Interesting.

Why not offer awards for scratch AND handicap results. Those with highly modified cars hate to be handicapped out of existence, while those with very standard cars know they cannot win the scratch awards but always stand a chance with the handicap awards.

Also, you have said that all cars must be road registered, taxed and MoT’d. Laudable, but it is possible, for example to get a ‘daylight running’ MoT and you can still end up with some very ‘hot’ road cars. Why not go the whole hog and say that cars must be driven to the venue? - that would be truly in the Lotus spirit.

4

yeah but driven how far? from the petrol station to track?

5

I take the point but there is a hurdle to be crossed here and that is that the car must be capabale of being driven on the public highway. If it is not monitored it might only be from the nearest garage/B&B/Trailer Park but it can be easily controlled. All you need is a filter point (pub/M’way ervices/ or similar) open for a couple of hours on the morning of the event at, say, five or ten miles out from the venue to which cars must arrive under their own power and then leave under their own power. Not really worth putting it back on the trailer and those that do will soon be clocked by their fellow competitors.

Not only that, such a regulation might prevent those who might be tempted to ‘cheat’ not to enter the championship in the first place, thus keeping it the reserve of proper road-going cars, which I think is what is intended by the way the regulation is currently worded.

6

The83man, you bring up two good points, this is my view on them but I’m happy to take them on board and discuss.

The handicap system will continue to evolve as more results are recorded.

I’ve tried the handicap formula on past sprint results and it brings the field very close. It doesn’t (though time will ultimately tell) overly bias or hinder low, med or high hp cars.

Here is an example of how it’s altered the result from two sprints:

(unfortunately come out small)

With regards driving to and from events as great as it would be to say you need to do this it then brings up another problem which I’m personally trying to get away from. You really can’t fit that many tools or different wheels/tyres in the car.

I currently drive my Elise to events on more road orientated tyres and then switch to R888s. To do this my long suffering girlfriend drives the other car up with tools, tyres, food/drink etc in it… or even a tent if we’re staying overnight. This sometimes proves a problem when she has something on that weekend. I’m trying to get a trailer so I can go it alone if required.

7

I agree that it is unrealistic to attempt sporting events without proper back up. From an organisers point of view, everyone turning up with a trailer, tow car and competing car means three spaces per entrant. What you do currently only takes up two spaces. I think everyone needs a wife/friend as a helper on the day so two cars is a good solution.

Of course, you could restrict tyres to List 1A. There are several good reasons why you might do this:

  1. It accords well with the ‘road car’ ethos
  2. It reduces work load on the day (no tyre changes or, if driven to the circuit, no unloading/loading from the trailer)
  3. It increases the challenge to do well on less soft rubber.
  4. You can’t get the soft ones properly warmed up at a sprint meeting anyway so the performance advantage is minimal
  5. It’s cheaper

All of which adds up to more people having fun as opposed to working flat out all day to achieve optimum performance over 4 runs lasting, usually, no more than 4 minutes in total!

In your table, your handicap has demoted the guy who has spent a good deal of money tweaking his car up to 300bhp, and probably with other suitable mods, from 1st in Class to 4th in Class. Why should he bother to compete? Or spend money fettling his car? He’s soon realise that he is not going to win because he has worked harder on his car than anybody else in the class - very demotivating. So, let him have the scratch award, which says “well done for working so hard to produce a really quick car that you drive well” but the championship can be decided on the handicap awards - which gives the guy with the standard car a good chance of winning. That way they are both motivated to enter and score points.

Please don’t take all this as an attack on your proposed championship - I think it’s a great idea but you’ve got to make it work for everyone otherwise they will not come out to play.

8

Restricting to list 1A also then throws up another problem. Exiges come out the factory with 1B tyres as standard and a lot of owners subsequently ‘upgrade’ to 1B tyres on Elises even without looking to get their cars on track. I use Toyo R1Rs as a road tyre and that’s 1B.

I don’t want exclude or add cost to someone who wants to compete but doesn’t want to purchase and extra set of wheels just for sprinting. If they are starting out afresh there’s quite and expense to equip with helmets, overalls and gloves.

This restriction is used in AutoSolos and I know of a fair few people you’d love to get involved but won’t due to having to buy 1A tyres.

There is a performance advantage on 888s/AO48s from what I’ve found even under such a small space of time, but more compounded over the longer sprints; such as the Great Western Sprint at Castle Combe.

Most of the elises I’ve seen at sprints actually tend to conform to the rule you have suggested of driving to the events. Makes it more social when you have to run round the paddock beg/borrow/stealing tools :slight_smile:

The 300bhp guy is me :wink: and in fairness I’m not that good at driving… getting better though. Also the guys in the Sport 160 and 190 have been driving the Colerne circuit for years.

The forumla is a work in progress. The idea for it came from the TVR speed series which use it to great success over for a number of years. I’m in discussion with their series organiser on how to tweak the one I came up with better.

The scratch award is a good one, but don’t also forget that you will still be competing against other cars for event trophies in standard MSA or event specific classes according to the motor club that is hosting.


/Forgot to say that I really appreciate your input. Exactly what I’m after, as you rightly point out I need to get it correct from the off so as to attract and maintain interest in it.

Keith

9

[quote=LoafingWafu]Restricting to list 1A also then throws up another problem. Exiges come out the factory with 1B tyres as standard and a lot of owners subsequently ‘upgrade’ to 1B tyres on Elises even without looking to get their cars on track. I use Toyo R1Rs as a road tyre and that’s 1B.

I don’t want exclude or add cost to someone who wants to compete but doesn’t want to purchase and extra set of wheels just for sprinting. If they are starting out afresh there’s quite and expense to equip with helmets, overalls and gloves.

[color:#CC0000]Good points. I’ve always been surprised that R1Rs are in list 1B. What about allowing tyres from list 1B that are a standard fitment? You could easily produce a list of acceptable tyres that avoid the need to change wheels, e.g R1Rs allowed but not 888, or even 888s allowed but not 048s, to keep the cost down.[/color]

This restriction is used in AutoSolos and I know of a fair few people you’d love to get involved but won’t due to having to buy 1A tyres.

There is a performance advantage on 888s/AO48s from what I’ve found even under such a small space of time, but more compounded over the longer sprints; such as the Great Western Sprint at Castle Combe.

Most of the elises I’ve seen at sprints actually tend to conform to the rule you have suggested of driving to the events. Makes it more social when you have to run round the paddock beg/borrow/stealing tools :slight_smile:

[color:#990000]Yes, exactly my point[/color]

The 300bhp guy is me :wink: and in fairness I’m not that good at driving… getting better though. Also the guys in the Sport 160 and 190 have been driving the Colerne circuit for years.

The forumla is a work in progress. The idea for it came from the TVR speed series which use it to great success over for a number of years. I’m in discussion with their series organiser on how to tweak the one I came up with better.

The scratch award is a good one, but don’t also forget that you will still be competing against other cars for event trophies in standard MSA or event specific classes according to the motor club that is hosting.

[color:#990000]The main point is to make it fun for everyone and there is nothing to stop you giving your own class scratch awards, over and above the class awards from the event organiser, provided it is is covered in the Championship regulations.[/color]


/Forgot to say that I really appreciate your input. Exactly what I’m after, as you rightly point out I need to get it correct from the off so as to attract and maintain interest in it.

Keith

[color:#990000]My pleasure. I spend my life trying to keep competitors happy![/color]
[/quote]

10

Goodwood has now been confirmed as a qualifying round for next year :slight_smile:

11

I think a control tyre is needed, as in reality if you have the funds to get the car to MSA blue book you can afford some 888s

12

I hear what you’re saying but why in reality is it needed?

The big cost to get into sprinting is personal safety gear. To reach the minimum the MSA require in road going classes all you need is a timing strut, numbers, sticker to show how to turn the ignition off and some yellow tape on the negative battery terminal, not saying you shouldn’t invest more in safety gear though.

To try and equalise between 1A and 1B I planned to do this.

Category 1: List 1A tyres +0%
Category 2: List 1B and 1A tyres +2.25% of base handicap

List 1A and 1B tyres are as defined in the MSA Blue Book. Road legal tyres, which do not appear in List 1A or List 1B shall be treated as List 1B.

Just means people can compete with whatever they have on and not have to change tyres unnecessarily. Also means that if they pick Cat 2, they can switch between 1A and 1B dependent on the weather.

Again this is down to affordability and personal preference.

13

I do applaud, but dont envy your job here.

Would love to get mine in cat 3 though

14

The biggest challenge is going to be getting people to sign up and attend events.

Creating rules and regs are the easy bits!

15

We now have a logo :slight_smile:

16

Events in bold are now confirmed. - Unless stated as 2012 the dates are 2011 dates to give you an idea where in the month they fall. This will be updated as soon as I know.

13th March - North Weald - Borough 19
31st March 2012 - Castle Combe - Great Western Sprint - Bristol MC
28th April 2012 - Goodwood - Bognor Regis MC
29th May - Snetterton - Borough 19
11th June - Abingdon - CARnival - Sutton & Cheam MC (2 sprints in 1 day)
23rd June 2012 - Castle Combe - Dick Mayo - Bristol MC
07th Aug - Hethel - Borough 19
13th Aug - Curborough - BARC Midlands
10th Sept - Brands Hatch - Tunbridge Wells MC

So just Brands to confirm now :clp

Getting there!

17

To give you an idea of what each event will be like have a look below.

North Weald - March

Should be familiar to a lot of people.

The course using the secondary runway, comprises one lap of approximately 2.31km of straights with left and right turns on a tarmac surface.

Format - 2 practice runs and 3 timed runs

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �65

Castle Combe - March

The course will be 1� of a lap of the racing circuit. The start is at the pit lane exit, the finish at Westway on the second lap. Exit from the course is via the pit lane slip road into the paddock.

The length of the course is 3.3 miles, one and three quarters of a lap, consisting of five right hand corners, five fast right hand bends, four left hand bends and four natural right/left chicanes.

Format - 1 practice of 2� laps and 2 times runs.

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �117

Goodwood - April

The length of the course is approximately 2.4 miles (3.86 kilometres) consisting of one lap of the circuit comprising six major corners and one chicane.

Format - 1 practice of 2 laps and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105 dBA. Continual monitoring of vehicle noise emissions will also be undertaken throughout the event any vehicle exceeding 101 dB(A) while practising or competing on the track will be excluded.

Cost - �110

Snetterton - May

The course will be the Snetterton 100 circuit and competitors will complete one and three quarter laps.

Format - 2 practice runs and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �120

Abingdon - June

Its unique 2 Courses means that it is effectively 2 Sprints in 1 day and with 8 timed runs it represents excellent value for money.

The event will comprise of 2 separate courses:
Course A = 1,460 metres total length, with a number of fast sweeping left and right-hand curves.
Course B = 1,842 metres total length which shall include 4 x 90-degree turns.

Format - 2 practice runs of each course and 2 timed runs over each course with the shortest time over each course being added together to give a final total score.

Noise - 105 dBA

Castle Combe - June

The length of the course is 1.55 miles, three quarters of a lap, consisting of two right hand corners, three fast right
hand bends, two left hand bends and two natural right/left chicanes. The start is at the race start line, the finish at Westway. Exit from the course is via the pit lane slip road into the paddock.

Format - 2 practice runs and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �97

Hethel - Aug

The Course comprises one lap of approximately 2 miles of straights, with left and right turns on a sealed tarmac surface.

Format - 2 practice runs and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105dBA

Cost - �85

Curborough - Aug

The Long Course (2 laps) is 1,557 yards, consisting of a tarmac surface not less than 15 feet wide with several fast curves.

Format - 2 practice and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �75

Brands Hatch - Sep

The course will be 1.5 laps of the Indy circuit of approximately 1.24 mile length and consists of left and right hand bends, straights and gradients on a tarmac surface.

Format - 1 practice of 2.5 laps and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �170

18

[quote=LoafingWafu]To give you an idea of what each event will be like have a look below.

Brands Hatch - Sep

The course will be 1.5 laps of the Indy circuit of approximately 1.24 mile length and consists of left and right hand bends, straights and gradients on a tarmac surface.

Format - 1 practice of 2.5 laps and 2 timed runs.

Noise - 105 dBA

Cost - �170 [/quote]

I like the sound of this series and if things go okay for me over the winter I’ll be putting my name down for a few events.

Quick question though, did you accidentally put a ‘1’ at the start of that price, or does it really say five laps of Brand Snatch Indy for �170?!

19

Hi Renton,

Sorry it’s taken a while to reply. But the price for Brands is correct… and I’ve had a rethink on that one. Now looking to substitute that event for one at RAF Odiham the week before which is around �75 and you should get more than the standard 2 practice and 2 timed runs as well.

Just waiting for confirmation on that event then I’ll be registering the championship and will start rounding up competitors.

Regards,

Keith.

20

Good Call. BH is very expensive to hire and you can have just as much fun for less. Good luck with it all!