[quote=seriouslylotus][quote=ade]I am hoping to get an engine rebuilt in the next couple of months and might well ask to JSR to show me the benefit of the Syvecs over my remapped ECU, I realise I will have to pay for mapping time to do this, but I am not prepared to lay out the full cost of the ECU to find I get no benefit from a different ECU.
[/quote]
Ade
As I understand it, and being honest my understanding is limited!!! Its not about headline figures, any good ecu mapped properly should give similar numbers. It more about having a fully mapable solution so that each time an up grade is done we have a choice of who to use rather than just one.
With many other nice benifits the Syvecs can give…
Look at what randy has done with his Europa on a Syvecs
I will 100% be having a syvecs and will be very very happy to go all the way to Ryan and have him do the mapping
[/quote]
This is to some point what has me worried, Lotus could only make 260hp with their ECU and 270hp with a smaller pulley in the 2-11, so seeing number 30hp greater does make me wonder if the Lotus ECU in the end is just rubbish and can’t get the full potential of the engine, if that really is the case then I want one already
[quote=ade]
I for one am really interested in this, but for me it really is all about it’s potential to give me more HP from my modified engine and remove my tie to Essex, the downsides for me are being able to find a local tuner who is both skilled in Syvecs and also understands a SC 2ZZ, this for me might be difficult [/quote]
Ryan of 2barTuning & Syvecs maps at Surrey Rolling Road, it’s hardly far from Essex.
It’s like complaining about the crappy BMW maps. Some chap down the road can do you a remap for �300 and get an extra 100BHP.
I think Lotus have to follow the same rules as the other manufacturers otherwise how can these back street re-mappers get more power that Merc/BMW/Audi etc.
In some countries the above 3 will give you (for a price) a new official map after you have run it in giving a lot more power and a warranty.
I think the important thing is to look at the base map figure, and see the gains with the Syvecs, rather than ultimate numbers.
Base map was on a 240PP car, so small fuel pump, bigger OE injectors, not fully opening the throttle plate. However the figures are pretty similar to what Lotus claim, 240 at the flywheel.
The same corrections were then applied to the Syvecs solution, so in my eyes, thats a pretty fair test.
There is no gaurantee that any car will give the same figures on any two different rolling roads of the same make, let alone different makes and different ways of mesuring - hub dyno to rollers.
[quote=JDS]OK, response from Ryan. Ignore the evening/yesterday comments, as its taken a while to notice it in my junk folder due to the links!!
"Good Evening!
I first must point out in case it has been miss-read or has not been stated
properly, but this thread is not advertising a finished product or a full
release of any package as yet.
Yesterday was another test session to ensure that the Can-bus coding for the
later exiges worked with the stock dash and that the base map done over the
last week at Syvecs on another early Exige with Improved fuel system could
be adjusted to suit a 240 spec. As 85% of the calibration would be the same
I made some adjustments to the fuel calibrations to work with the smaller
injectors and the result is posted by OP. During Logging it was noted for JS
Racing that the Injector Duties were high and that for this given spec
larger injectors were required or either a reduced DBW Final target at high
RPM or lower rev limit. If you look carefully at the graph displayed by the
OP you will see that on the final graph printed we were not reving as high
as the engine does as standard due to the injector duties being above a safe
working 90% stated by Denso so number chasing is not what yesterday was
about otherwise the limiter would have just been rasied.
Having had an Exige at Syvecs for the last week I have been able to go over
nearly every calibration fully with varying cell temps, loads and pressures
to ensure that Corrections for different atmospheric changes. I have logged
over 95 Miles of Solid State tuning of the engine and well over 50 hard
sweeps at varying Temps from as cold as 5c all the way up to over 70c Air
Charge temp by changing cell conditions… We can simulate track sessions
also which was done but real work on this will be done soon. As the Syvecs
has over 4 hours of onboard logging the next test is at a private track for
the day setting up adjustable traction control and other safety orientated
maps like trips for Oil pressure drop, Relative fuel pressure trips etc as
well as ensuring the calibration is perfect.
I’m not sure on your comments regarding cooling between runs unfortunately I
have to analysis all data very carefully and correct for any changes which
take time. As you have said chasing numbers is for “fools” but unfortunately
that is the figure the engine produced between runs while tweaking the
calibrations to suit the spec and we are not talking about a quick 4 second
pull like on some Dynojet dynos but a 10-25 second pull where the ACT change
40c + from 2000 to 8000rpm.
With regards the comments of knock control and supercharger noise I can see
it being a problem on the stock system and on nearly every other aftermarket
ecu where the inputs are not gated and only work of raw values with a
calibration table to act on when the raw value passes the threshold.
Our Strategy is developed by our sister company Life Racing who supply and
managed all the electronics for most of the top levels of motorsport
including 24hr LMP Cars which some have over 1000hp forced induction knock
limited engines and survive race after race over a full 24hr period of
constant load. We then take the strategy and make it suit all the road
market that has helped us to achieve the fastest going road cars on pump
fuel around the world. One of which I tuned and is over 1400hp and runs 8’s
down the strip with zero engine failures over last 3 years thanks to the
Syvecs Controls, engine trips and knock control.
So in a nut shell how does it work?
We use a number of fully gated knock inputs which are then filtered down to
a theoretical knock frequency value based on applying some maths to the size
of the combustion chamber. This is a fully adjustable calibration and is the
first step to ignoring all background noise.
We then know which cylinder is firing based on the information gathered from
the Crank sensor and Cam sensor and enter a desired “listening” window for
when the strategy should listen based on crank angle for each cylinder. This
again then reduces the chance of ghost knock detection from external items.
After this the levels of gains are adjusted to ensure all the values from
each cylinder are matching and then the strategy goes onto another level for
how detection is applied I.E Trims and full cylinder shut downs in the event
of more than a desired amount of retard pulled.
Here is a Log from the Exige to it working
And then back to correct calibration
As you can see it very useful for spotting problems on individual cylinders
and very fast to act and remove knock.
Also you can see good the Closed loop lambda works keeping the A/F within a
0.5% of target and if this goes out of a set range then it again will warn
owners for example if fuel temps increases and mixtures changes or a faulty
pump.
Sorry I am having to send this via John but can not unfortunately log on to
Exige forum due to activation issues??
I hear you have a very powerful Lotus and to get to that levels I’m sure a
lot of R&D was done which can imagine some of was finding the right man for
calibrating the ecu. I guess from your comments regarding some tuners that
the first man was not! so can understand while seeing what John had put
might make you comments valid but im sure as you well know getting a
finished product take testing, testing and more testing!
Ryan Griffiths
Syvecs UK"
Hope that clears up any questions and querries, although I am expecting some more after posting this!! [/quote]
Hey Ryan thanks for the reply, this is the responce I wanted to see. Now hurry up and get it finished since these guys are in need of a proper tuner with a ecu to work with…
I like the fact that you are doing long pulls on the dyno…
Now toss out the BHP numbers and let’s have WHP figures…
Perfect, this is what I expected to see ~30hp different to my best on a cold day. I am still intrigued to see what it can do with mine, it is really good to hear the base and cold running maps are well on their way as well, keep up the good work, if there is any money left after my engine rebuild I will be having a dash or an ECU, just not sure which yet…
Dan the dyno guy for whatever reason moved to Liverpool I believe the dyno has since followed him, not sure how I now stand with dyno and mapping I am going to talk to Andy at EA on Saturday when I deliver my engine there
[quote=Adamantium]Get the ecu - it will do far more for you than the dash will.
What kind of engine rebuild are we talking here?
I think I’m just going straight for the audi 1.8T. [/quote]
I am having a low comp 2ZZ built, I am then going to run the smallest pulley I can on the SC and see what we get.
I do realise there are possible benefits of the replacement ECU but I then am not sure if I will use them or not, when my car is mapped and done I drive it away and don’t want to play with it, just turn the key it start and I drive to the track. This does remove some of the benefits of the replacement ECU.
Ade, I,d seriously consider adding a turbo if I were building a low compression motor …
I suppose you’ve considered this tho ?
Superchargers are great but suffer badly from that damn law of diminishing returns
[/quote]
