Out on another trackday this weekend, and whilst i ws there entered the 0-60 challenge and the 1/4 mile, however found the weak point on the car this being the clutch. Need it replacing as soon as because of Oulton park on the 9th.
Anybody out there who can reccommend a good clutch set up ?
Don’t want an ON-OFF switch version and not Mega heavy but i could manage a heavier than normal.
Should I get the flywheel lightened at the same time are there any noticable benifits on the Lotus, like there used to be on my MINI ?
Regards
Chris
P.s Looking for actual make and models if you know them. TA
I have to say that i intended to only do the Trackday on Sunday; however the car was bought with the sole purpose of having some fun in and against better judgement it seemed a good idea at the time !!
Please don’t wince too much as it was a bonus that it has shown up now at the end of a good day rather than at the start of an expensive track day !!
It was a great track with some tight man made chicanes in which the Exige was awesome, late on the MMC’s and lighteningly quick direction changes made it uncatchable apart from the Aieral Atom !!
AP is a good clutch and lasts…although I do wince a little at what you have been doing with your car
I am on the second AP and am absolutely displeased with it.
Those quotes that it can take up to 250 ft/lbs of torque are rubbish (ok, probably static, but not while spinning the clutch).
Even when I had 177 BHP I could still make it spin and burn.
If you want to make somoe quick starts you’ll need a multi plate clutch.
I kow Giles from here used some new one but can’t remember which.
I really rate the AP clutch. I can’t understand how you have made it slip mate, mine never has, and I haven’t heard of anyone else either.
Yes lighten the flywheel!
Sean…
Very easy, doing a quick getaway means engaging the clutch at peak RPM, none of that sidestepping or redline crap.
At this moment the wheels are not turning and the engine is running towards 5K- 6K rpm? whatever your engine works at.
By the time it gets to peak torque, the wheels are turning very little and the engine is turning, well, a lot.
Then you start really moving.
Witness smoke from the clutch. Once it gets that hot it needs to cool down to restore grip, and it takes time on the confined environment of the clutch housing.
The AP one won�t slip if you put in 250 lb/ft of torque without slipping, but that doesn�t happen. So you either don�t do a real quick getaway (in which case even the std one is ok) or fit a stronger one.
Little know fact, but I used to street race a 304ci Barracuda and 360ci Charger in my time (big V8 yank machinery)
More or less like some youths do now but without the bling. All engine mods, no rubbish (back in the early 80�s)
And every once in a while I like to get away quickly from a standstill (sorry )
No worries mate, I never thought you were having a go!
For the time being I will still use the AP, because even though I changed it last time (because I just had bought one and it was there) it wasn�t that worn after many standing starts. The fact that it smokes and spins doesn�t wear them that much, it�s more like the surface of the pad material gets really hot and releases gases (like some I know )
But after this one is gone, I will go for the one that Giles (who sometimes frequents this site) had in his car: the Super Clutch (yes I know, like bragging!)
They are a small company that Giles met at Autosport and they had a go on adapting this clutch to the PG1. AFAIK it was originally designed for a V8 engine!
It�s 184mm diam, (so needs a small flywheel), twin plate design.
I�d go for that.
BUT I have another problem, I�ve had some crunching gears when I change quickly, it seems that I have worn some of the synchro mesh rings. Benn speaking with Quaife and the only way forward (for somebody that refuses to change gears slowly) is to go dog engagement. But I don�t want to spend �4500!
Or change the synchro mesh rings often. But they�re Rover parts and there are no more dealers!
Somebody must have some of these, just wondering now how to source out some.
Bugger!
(meanwhile I�ll just drive it like that, when I change gears slowly they don�t crunch)
I treat the AP clutch in my car pretty badly sometimes and must be honest that at the price you just can’t beat it. It stood up to a whole weekend of standing starts recently, I was really impressed that it lasted. Don’t think the expense of a twin plate is worth it unless you have huge torque.
Pretty sure AP claim the clutch will handle 240 NM and not 250 ft/lbs.
On the subject of synchro rings Uldis, I am having the same problem, but have already comitted to going dog engagement, have quite a nice motor going in next month and want to rebuild the box while it is out. Have you tried land rover for the synchro’s I recently bought driveshaft seals from them.
BTW, I just spoke to a guy somebody from Lotus recommended as a PG1 gearbox guru and he assures me the parts are still available, as long as Hinda is around.
Yep, it seems that Honda made the PG1 (or makes it still?) so the rings are readily available!
Hi Guys !
Cheers for the clutch info, even though we have now gone onto gerboxes it’s all good reading.
I phoned AP technical this morning and was told that the AP CP 2000-14 kit sold through elise parts will definitely slip on my car due to the torque output. it is only rated to 240NM or 170ish ft/ib so on the TT conversions even the baby one pushes out over 210…
This causes a huge problem as i get exactly the same smoking joe scenaro on quick take offs as you have explained in your previous thread. Some one had suggested a paddle plate but a lower clamping force (Obviously a sales pitch) As AP said this would not work as again it would still allow the ceramic material to slip when hot !!
So i guess i am still no closer to buying a replacement clutch as the answer is either
a. Buy the AP and drive carefully ( That’s a NO !)
b. Buy a paddle version and loose some driveability
c. Find out more about this " Super Clutch "
Anyone else out there with a different clutch in a big torque car ?
Call the Suoer Clutch guy: Tony Tewson on 01926-812136. Website
That’s certainly the one I will go for next time, but it means fitting a different flywheel (smaller).
Ultra light and low inertia so improved throttle response. But you have the extra cost of the flywheel.
Giles had been looking for a while for one and he didn’t find anything.
The other guys that were close to develop one were Helix, but there were always delayed, not interested enough obviously.
Giles is pretty happy with it, and especially from having chosen the organic pads. The ceramic ones would geive more of an on-off action which is not so desirable on the road.
On futher research it seems that some more owners of tuned Exige’s that i have spoken to have also had problems with the AP clutch kit, mainly for fast starts when you need to load the car from a static position. Once moving around the track it’s not so much of an issue !
I will definitely be phoning the company from the clutch link and get their views about this !!
Do any other Rover clutches fit ? Maybe a high torque turbo version ?
Contacted "Super Clutch " This morning and spoke to a gentleman called Tony. He was very helpful, it was evident that he was an engineer by trade and not a salesman and therefore was able to explain all about the various clutch issues on the modified K series engines. As you said they do a very high quality replacement version in both metalic or organic plates single or double. The flywheel has to be either re machined or changed. There is someone who makes an off the shelf lightened and balanced item to go with this clutch set up. it isn’t cheap but i guess in the long run after spending money on replacement clutches and labour it works out about the same.
Still looking into a Rover replacement variant !!