The exige s1 puts out 420 HP on the wheels on a reliable dyno, i have seen it and use the dyno for my car as well. The motor is 2l with turbo and no nitrous. Tires used are bridgestone dot legal semi slicks. We are waiting for new hubs so traction off the line can be improved and can then use the proper drag radials. It has a tendency to snap side shafts so we are keeping camber safe at the moment.
Incidently the car ran 274km/h today on a standing start 1km run .
I do not set this car up for the owner to be quick on the track, it is a drag car and we have tried to find a compromise. Car started out doing 11.6s we then did the following:
Ride heights with driver on board
Camber F -0.8
R -1.1
Toe F 0
R 1.2 mm each side - very important to be exactly the same.
There are many other things but these i think are what you were looking for, we take more camber out when the hubs are in. Car launches straight and true every time, car now runs consistent 10.9 and we expect more soon.
Hope this helps, less camber means more tire on the road and less wheelspin. I would if possible on the day go for 0 camber for the 1/4 and braking, then remove all shims for track work. Toe is more difficultto adjust at the track so stick with something that will be ok for both, less toe equals straighter pull aways.
Sorry yes checking your post it has a quaife LSD, also make sure yur diffusor is fitted as this helps big time, at those sorts of speeds drag creates 1 or 2 mph losses. Which could be the difference between winning and losing, take the mirrors off to if you can.
Hope this answers your questions, best of luck at showing the cubic inch boys how it should be done
We are running 17x7.5 wheels up front which allows us to put a 328mm Alcon rotor on the car. Our new 2 piston rear kit will use a slightly smaller rotor in back as we are adding to much braking force back there with that kit and will upset the balance of the car.
Our current kit shaves 2 pounds per side in the rear and 1 pound per side in the front. We will also be having spindles made from Aluminum for even more weight savings.
Brett.
I suppose that weight saving will not even compensate for the added weight of the bigger wheels/tyres, eh?
Why the obsession with bigger wheels!? Most people seem to prefer the 15"F 16"R combination on the early Elise for track anyway…
I know, but then for a lightweight car there’s no real need for brakes that big, is there?
I mean, I had trouble with brakes constantly and controlled them by duct-cooling them. Still on the original calipers but 295mm disks.
And most people here know I’m a late braker.
I really don’t think anything over 295mm is needed, and that because you can’t fit an air ducting to inside vane with 284mm disks.
So 295mm it is.
We are running 17x7.5 wheels up front which allows us to put a 328mm Alcon rotor on the car. Our new 2 piston rear kit will use a slightly smaller rotor in back as we are adding to much braking force back there with that kit and will upset the balance of the car.
Our current kit shaves 2 pounds per side in the rear and 1 pound per side in the front. We will also be having spindles made from Aluminum for even more weight savings.
Brett.
I suppose that weight saving will not even compensate for the added weight of the bigger wheels/tyres, eh?
Why the obsession with bigger wheels!? Most people seem to prefer the 15"F 16"R combination on the early Elise for track anyway…
Actually we saved a total of 28 pounds off the original wheels and tires going bigger! The SSR Comps weigh 13 pounds each guys. We are all about saving weight on this car, and increasing braking performance at the same time. Thats why are brakes are bigger, better and LIGHTER than stock. Our turbo kit adds only 10 kg to the car’s weight as well. It is vital to us to keep the weight down on this car. That’s why we are redoing the spindles, rear sub frame, new rotors, etc to reduce weight off the car.
God you lot are pedantic. I’d have thought “horsepower needs bigger brakes” is fairly self explanatory.
Look forward to reading the article in C&D Brett.
Thanks mate. Yes we hope to do well against the competition as well. Apparently there will be an another Elise there with a Honda K20 swap from Joe McCarthy. Should be a good match up with our turbo Toyota motor against his supercharged Honda engine.
The exige s1 puts out 420 HP on the wheels on a reliable dyno, i have seen it and use the dyno for my car as well. The motor is 2l with turbo and no nitrous. Tires used are bridgestone dot legal semi slicks. We are waiting for new hubs so traction off the line can be improved and can then use the proper drag radials. It has a tendency to snap side shafts so we are keeping camber safe at the moment.
Incidently the car ran 274km/h today on a standing start 1km run .
I do not set this car up for the owner to be quick on the track, it is a drag car and we have tried to find a compromise. Car started out doing 11.6s we then did the following:
Ride heights with driver on board
Camber F -0.8
R -1.1
Toe F 0
R 1.2 mm each side - very important to be exactly the same.
There are many other things but these i think are what you were looking for, we take more camber out when the hubs are in. Car launches straight and true every time, car now runs consistent 10.9 and we expect more soon.
Hope this helps, less camber means more tire on the road and less wheelspin. I would if possible on the day go for 0 camber for the 1/4 and braking, then remove all shims for track work. Toe is more difficultto adjust at the track so stick with something that will be ok for both, less toe equals straighter pull aways.
Sorry yes checking your post it has a quaife LSD, also make sure yur diffusor is fitted as this helps big time, at those sorts of speeds drag creates 1 or 2 mph losses. Which could be the difference between winning and losing, take the mirrors off to if you can.
Hope this answers your questions, best of luck at showing the cubic inch boys how it should be done
Thanks for the informative post Jason!! We really appreciate it. Unfortunately for this Car and Driver event we have to run everything in one time run. There is no seperate event to set up 1/4 mile runs, then track runs. Everything is timed in 1 long run. For the Motor Trend and Sport Compact Car tests we can change and fiddle with the settings. Here is me driving our Turbo Elise from the June issue of Sport Compact Car:
That issue we had only 240whp with our bolt on low boost turbo kit. We should have close to 370-380whp for the next test with Motor Trend and Sport Compact Car. We will have to run crappy street gas for the Car and Driver event so we will probably be limited to around 340whp for that test. Thanks again for the informative post and your car looks sweet! I love those Mazda turbo motors, I used to own a Mazda 323 with a BP 1.8 turbo motor that was an awesome platform to make good power from.
I know, but then for a lightweight car there’s no real need for brakes that big, is there?
I mean, I had trouble with brakes constantly and controlled them by duct-cooling them. Still on the original calipers but 295mm disks.
And most people here know I’m a late braker.
I really don’t think anything over 295mm is needed, and that because you can’t fit an air ducting to inside vane with 284mm disks.
So 295mm it is.
No, I know.
And I see on your other post that your bigger wheels are lighter.
Well, if you’re not gaining any rotational inertia and you have now the space to run bigger disks, it makes sense.
BTW, did you have to modify the wheel arch liners to fit the bigger wheels?
On the S1 the wheels already make holes in the arches.
Jason - I don’t think there is such a thing as a reliable rolling road. If you really are seeing that sort of power, which would suprise me, I would suggest that you use a proper dyno to map the thing otherwise you are heading for trouble IMHO.
Forcefed - the standard calipers are perfectly up to stopping your car, you just need the right discs and pads.
Nice numbers…but 400 bhp from a turbo engine… does it makes sense for everything that is not a straight line?
I also own a seven with 260bhp from a turbo engine, it is really hard and not easy to drive. OK it pulls quite strong but the same car with a n/a engine with 30-40 bhp could be faster.
So why r we pumping out all this power if we need to go through curves?
400 bhp in an elise … for me…absurd!
Anyway it is always good that people work and test new idea and stuff.
Now back to the topic:
I’ve AP 4 pots with 295 discs fron a nd 2 pots with 295 rear. I had to put a bias valve to lower pressure on rear brakes.
Personally i think that such a setup could cope with much more heat than i can generate now and i would never fit bigger brakes if not needed because remember:
“To go faster…add lightness!”
Bigger brakes often means more wight.
No, I know.
And I see on your other post that your bigger wheels are lighter.
Well, if you’re not gaining any rotational inertia and you have now the space to run bigger disks, it makes sense.
BTW, did you have to modify the wheel arch liners to fit the bigger wheels?
On the S1 the wheels already make holes in the arches.
No modifications needed to run the 17’s up front with 205/40/17 tires.
Forcefed - the standard calipers are perfectly up to stopping your car, you just need the right discs and pads.
Having done multiple track sessions on upgraded pads with the stock brakes we feel they are simply inadequate for our needs, even with 190 horsepower. The stock brakes are easily overwhelmed when driving hard on the street and fade badly after 3 hard stops from 80mph. Sport Compact Car tested the car from 80mph-0 with horrible results on the third run in a row. Our Evo VIII Alcon equipped car did it’s best braking at the same facility on the 19th stop in a row! And set braking records for that magazine from 60-0, 70-0 and 80-0. The full weight Evo VIII with only our 6 piston Alcon brake kit stopped from 70-0 in 20 feet less than an Enzo Ferrari. That is the braking performance we want in the Elise.
Nice numbers…but 400 bhp from a turbo engine… does it makes sense for everything that is not a straight line?
I also own a seven with 260bhp from a turbo engine, it is really hard and not easy to drive. OK it pulls quite strong but the same car with a n/a engine with 30-40 bhp could be faster.
So why r we pumping out all this power if we need to go through curves?
400 bhp in an elise … for me…absurd!
Anyway it is always good that people work and test new idea and stuff.
Now back to the topic:
I’ve AP 4 pots with 295 discs fron a nd 2 pots with 295 rear. I had to put a bias valve to lower pressure on rear brakes.
Personally i think that such a setup could cope with much more heat than i can generate now and i would never fit bigger brakes if not needed because remember:
“To go faster…add lightness!”
Bigger brakes often means more wight.
Nicolas
400 horsepower from the Toyota motor is easily done and not at all stressfull or difficult to drive as the motor produces low torque numbers. This makes the car easier to get off the line and makes it tractable without overwhelming the chassis.
We are working on an upgraded motor swap package for next year that will have around 330 N/A horsepower which should be ideal for track guys and street guys alike. We will keep you informed of our progress on that one!
Forcefed - the standard calipers are perfectly up to stopping your car, you just need the right discs and pads.
Having done multiple track sessions on upgraded pads with the stock brakes we feel they are simply inadequate for our needs, even with 190 horsepower. The stock brakes are easily overwhelmed when driving hard on the street and fade badly after 3 hard stops from 80mph. Sport Compact Car tested the car from 80mph-0 with horrible results on the third run in a row. Our Evo VIII Alcon equipped car did it’s best braking at the same facility on the 19th stop in a row! And set braking records for that magazine from 60-0, 70-0 and 80-0. The full weight Evo VIII with only our 6 piston Alcon brake kit stopped from 70-0 in 20 feet less than an Enzo Ferrari. That is the braking performance we want in the Elise.
In which case you are using the wrong materials. Get some Padgids and some decent discs (plenty of people do these). I have used standard calipers with Padgid 42’s on the front and 14’s at the rear on my (Honda) Exige with slicks on and they are perfectly up to the job. On the Elise race car I drive we use standard front calipers and, again, they are perfectly up to the job.
Forcefed - the standard calipers are perfectly up to stopping your car, you just need the right discs and pads.
Having done multiple track sessions on upgraded pads with the stock brakes we feel they are simply inadequate for our needs, even with 190 horsepower. The stock brakes are easily overwhelmed when driving hard on the street and fade badly after 3 hard stops from 80mph. Sport Compact Car tested the car from 80mph-0 with horrible results on the third run in a row. Our Evo VIII Alcon equipped car did it’s best braking at the same facility on the 19th stop in a row! And set braking records for that magazine from 60-0, 70-0 and 80-0. The full weight Evo VIII with only our 6 piston Alcon brake kit stopped from 70-0 in 20 feet less than an Enzo Ferrari. That is the braking performance we want in the Elise.
In which case you are using the wrong materials. Get some Padgids and some decent discs (plenty of people do these). I have used standard calipers with Padgid 42’s on the front and 14’s at the rear on my (Honda) Exige with slicks on and they are perfectly up to the job. On the Elise race car I drive we use standard front calipers and, again, they are perfectly up to the job.
We have run the car with Pagids and Hawk pads. We have not run with upgraded rotors however. Brakes are not good for the track in our opinion and need to be upgraded. We would like to try the car with upgraded rotors and pads to see if that is adequate for most track guys. We will have a set up soon that uses Alcon rotors front and rear.
Am I missing something here? Biger brakes do not make you stop any quicker, that is a function of tyres and grip or the apparent lack thereof…
However bigger brakes mean greater leverage so less effort to acheive the same pressure at the pads, but tyres locking up are tyres locking up and that’s that surely?
Sure they can cool better too, but then some brake ducting can certainly help but maybe that’s an ambient temp difference, IIRC in the Autobytel series they had trouble geting the brakes up to temp with the vents open, so the great british weather prolly works in our favour on that one