Jim.
Sorted!
Now go and have a wee dram of the finest Scotch in front of your new boiler! And look fwd to all those orders for th 4 : 1 over Christmas! 
He has my exhaust to play with over xmas, well he will if parcelforce ever remember where Aberdeen is 
No sign of it yet Ade - but then again, there’s loads of stuff sent to me nearly two weeks ago and it still hasn’t arrived.
Parcelforce stopped taking bookings a while back, although I got an e-mail this morning saying they will be accepting despatches on the 29th. Problem is, there’ll be no-one at the other end to receive it!
They are going to call me when it reaches you local depot, I might have had a bit of a rant at them 
Then i will let you know it is there and you can either collect it or get them to deliver (whatever is best for you).
[quote=pete757]Jim.
Sorted!
Now go and have a wee dram of the finest Scotch in front of your new boiler! And look fwd to all those orders for th 4 : 1 over Christmas! [/quote]
uurrrgh, sorry, there’s nothing winds me up so much as that statement - “it’s had large sums of money chucked at it” when it’s applied to an exhaust. Tell me how one design of catalyser is fit for purpose on a 134bgp 1zz-fe motor, a 190bhp 2zz-ge motor and a 260bhp SC 2zz-ge motor?
uurgh, I’m off again - is that boiler working?
Focus Jim Email… remember
To be perfectly honest Lotus aren’t specialists in exhaust research or production so I’ll leave that area to the guys who know what they’re talking about & doing.
my car went on the RR recently and had various different pimaries put on it. different lengths, different bores and both 4-2-1 and 4-1 , I believe. The bottom line is they made not a jot of difference to the dyno readings. Mine is a bog standard 240PP(well, was). So it would appear that the ECU mappings are making a difference. It could be argued that these weren’t Jim’s well respected products, but I would be surprised if that alone were the difference.
I will be doing a lot of tinkering over the winter and it will be interesting to see what difference these primaries make to what I’ve done. I’m afraid this won’t be very scientific as they won’t be before and after , back-to-back tests.
You’ve got to remap the ECU to deal with the change in AFR from the modifications. If you don’t adjust the fueling you’ll never make more power!
Please !!!
Just think before you post ?
If you stated a remap would give you “optimum” power , then fair enough .
Stating that you’ll never make more power ???
Really ?
FACT : adding a decent system = more power
FACT : adding a decent system and mapping = at least the same power as the above with the possibility of further gain…
Re mapping may indeed give enhanced results …
BUT its not necessary after each and every new part is put on the car .
I will indeed get my car re mapped …
But if I got it re mapped after every bolted on gizmo the blooming M1 would be my home !
Scenario : …
Jfk fitted new roof scoop : now runs lean cos air density increased = off to get mapped …
Jfk fettled the clam : denser air … off to get mapped.
Jfk fitted a Forge : yet again … denser air … better get it mapped dude …
Jfk now fitted TRD airbox : gonna run lean again … better get it mapped …gettin my drift yet ?
No holed pistons so jfk goes C,N and does the 260 conversion .
Jfk fits 2bular : result … no power gain !! Doh I forgot the drive down the M1 to get my 6th map done … HOW SILLY AM I ?
You completely miss my point Jim.
The whole engine, gearbox, exhaust, air box, oil pumping, feul burning lot of it were never designed to be in the back of a mid-engined sports car. Funny enough they were designed to go in that very same shopping trolley you talk about, and yes each and every component of that engine would have had thousands of pounds and hours of r+d spent on it’s final design… Go through the stock 2zz with a fine tooth comb and you can pick fault with every aspect of it in the application it’s now being asked to do. The power delivery isn’t as good as it could be, the gear box is weak at high hp and has all the wrong ratios, the exhaust system could be less restrictive to give better torque/power, multiple oil starvation problems under g, feul starvation problems…the list goes on and on. As I say you can pick fault with everything when your pushing the limits it was never designed to do. That doesn’t make the original design a pile of junk and not fit for purpose! Of course there is always going to be room for improvement i dont disagree with that at all.
As i say, the fact you can take a stock 2zz engine and basically bolt on a supercharger and go from 190 to 300hp keeping the stock components say’s alot about the original design…
Very valid points gav .
Indeed the motor is doing us all justice .
Can you think of a more effective route to improving the stock motor than the scavenging though ? I can’t …
And while I can’t … I fully commend the man that is investing his time in achieving fantastic results
[quote=TarmacTerrorist]You completely miss my point Jim.
The whole engine, gearbox, exhaust, air box, oil pumping, feul burning lot of it were never designed to be in the back of a mid-engined sports car… That doesn’t make the original design a pile of junk and not fit for purpose! [/quote]
It was never going to be at the price point that an Exige is at! If you want to buy a car that does have the extensive R and D behind every individual aspect of every point of engine, chassis, interior and exterior design being exactly fit for purpose, then you have to pay big bucks for it and buy a Fezza, Lambo etc etc. Every model is almost an individual work of art!
I reckon it is pretty amazing and bloody great that Lotus have managed to bolt together a car that you can buy from 6-45k, that will even in standard form give machinery well over a 100k a bloody good run for its money! And was originally designed with a light weight ‘K’ series lump but has still managed to cope with more weight, power, and environmental regulation!
Besides, mods are great fun, create great interest, keep many small businness going and create great banter in forums like this!
Completely agree with you on that pete
I’m only talking about exhaust design Gav - that’s what I know about. The std exhaust on the 2zz-ge is a POS - end of. Lotus should have at least looked at the manifold. Janspeed could have knocked an improved one out for pennies. The pish they spouted about optimising the manifold/cat pipe was …pish.
You carbon boy, where do you get those from 
[/quote]
This is mine Flatty … Clicky [/quote]
Cheers Dude
With regards to the thread myself and JFK are planning to meet at CN’s dyno in the new year with JFK’s new tubular system, my car has a silenced de cat std manifold and 2bular GT3. Other than that our cars are the same.
Same dyno, same day, should answer a few questions.
Boothy
No to contradict, but please remember that the original exhaust was only intended to provide 192ps. It was never intended for more. You can just go and read the 2zz development papers. There is written enough on the exhaust manifold design and the reasons for the design.
The manifolds primary design targets where to meet TLEV emissions standards which required a quick heat build up for the catalyzer to work as soon as possible while being easy to manufacture, enable the engine to give the needed power with adequate vibration and other design parameters (I am quoting indirectly from the paper here)
I can bet that your manifold while very efficient and optimal for performance will never achieve the emissions target intended for the engine when it was developed. I have had a proper performance 4-2-1 on my MR2 with 2ZZ since 2003 and the heat is vastly reduced but cold start emmissions go to hell.
[quote=pete757][quote=TarmacTerrorist]You completely miss my point Jim.
The whole engine, gearbox, exhaust, air box, oil pumping, feul burning lot of it were never designed to be in the back of a mid-engined sports car… That doesn’t make the original design a pile of junk and not fit for purpose! [/quote]
It was never going to be at the price point that an Exige is at! If you want to buy a car that does have the extensive R and D behind every individual aspect of every point of engine, chassis, interior and exterior design being exactly fit for purpose, then you have to pay big bucks for it and buy a Fezza, Lambo etc etc. Every model is almost an individual work of art!
[/quote]
yes but even with the massive r+d budgets the likes of Fezza, Lambo, Porsche etc spend, the cars have still all been designed around a very tight breif, that being predominantly a road going car… Start asking from them the same your now asking from your Lotus and you start hitting all the same problems - std brakes arent up to it, the suspension is way too soft, exhaust is restrictive and heavy, cooling issues etc. etc.
[quote=jfkFACT : adding a decent system = more power
[/quote]
Not what I found- fact!
(By ‘system’, we are only talking primaries in my case).
having said that, now I’m punching more power I will be fitting a new system.
LOL - you should have seen the AFR on my car when the 4-1 manifold was fitted and it went on the dyno…was running more lean than a butch bodybuilder. Add a bit of fuel to the map and guess what? it made more power.
Its not like I’ve spent the last four years modding my car and being a guinea pig. oh wait a minute. I really hope you don’t experience pinking because its a pain in the ass to fix without remapping the ECU.
If you look at most of the base Honda conversions a significant amount have had custom maps done at some point because every engine can be slightly different.
Please !!!
Just think before you post ?
If you stated a remap would give you “optimum” power , then fair enough .
Stating that you’ll never make more power ???
Really ?
FACT : adding a decent system = more power
FACT : adding a decent system and mapping = at least the same power as the above with the possibility of further gain…
Re mapping may indeed give enhanced results …
BUT its not necessary after each and every new part is put on the car .
I will indeed get my car re mapped …
But if I got it re mapped after every bolted on gizmo the blooming M1 would be my home !
Scenario : …
Jfk fitted new roof scoop : now runs lean cos air density increased = off to get mapped …
Jfk fettled the clam : denser air … off to get mapped.
Jfk fitted a Forge : yet again … denser air … better get it mapped dude …
Jfk now fitted TRD airbox : gonna run lean again … better get it mapped …gettin my drift yet ?
No holed pistons so jfk goes C,N and does the 260 conversion .
Jfk fits 2bular : result … no power gain !! Doh I forgot the drive down the M1 to get my 6th map done … HOW SILLY AM I ? [/quote]