282ps for the exige S

Dear Jammie, as you know there has never been a true dyno sheet posted on any fourm with regards to the Bemani supercharger in the Exige or Elise…7.5psi now we know… If you can please post your old Bemani dyno sheet…Thanks

Hum, no. It’s actually more like 8 psi, or to be exact 7.98 psi - not 7.5.

I would like to see the “100” supercharged Lotus list…I’d put money down on the fact that there are nowhere close to that many Bemani Lotus cars runnin around

I can assure you, there are over 100 bemani supercharged cars around - though most of them are probably running in Germany and Switzerland. Lotus dealers in Switzerland actually sell the Bemani kit as an official tuning option including full warranty, which also means that a large portion of new cars being sold are already equipped with the supercharger. Just check the official dealers websites such as Pfenninger (Zurich), Kumschick (Luzern) and Lotus West (St. Gallen) to see how many are for sale right this second. Then consider that Red Motorsport in Germany is also a large Lotus dealer that sells the Bemani kit. Not only that, but also do serious racing with it (Red Motorsport Exige RS). It’s even quite surprising to see that most 111Rs and Exiges I come across on the road are all supercharged as well.

100 kits isn’t all that hard to believe once you consider its been around for over 2 years (came out end 2004 / beginning 2005) and the kit since then has been sold directly by official dealers.

Bemani might not be all that well known outside Switzerland, but I can assure you that as an engine specialist and tuner, they are very highly regarded with the kits they bring out.

The funny thing about some guys that fork out the cash is that they will never admit they didn’t get what they paid for…

Perhaps, though there are more than enough people that have decided between kits before or have test driven them to know what they do deliver without forking out the cash. If you have your doubts, I could really care less as I am well aware of what the car does well. If it’s doing that at 250bhp, at the official 263bhp figure or at 275bhp - I really could care less.

I’m curious Frank - what exactly are you doubting about the official diagramm? Nothing in how the car performs has made me think that the diagramm is an overstatement. Especially when comparing it to “real” diagrams by other tuners or official 240 or Exige-S ones, doesn’t make the Bemani one any less plausible given it does run a higher boost level and has a larger supercharger. Besides, the kit isn’t new anyway - it’s more or less the identical kit that Bemani developed for the Toyota Corolla TS.

I also don’t get the hostility of yours given that a few in here are critizing (more like voicing their opinion) on the Komo-Tec 280S kit for the Exige-S. I don’t doubt that they are achieving the claimed power (as you are doubting with the Bemani kit), I just am less impressed by the peak power at after 8600 rpm and think it’s at a not very usuable spot. I would think that’s a valid concern, don’t you? Or are you that impressed with it? If so, why?

As I said before, I can not find one real dyno sheet of a Bamani supercharged Lotus anywhere…and have you ever dynoed your car to see if the learning ECU has changed it’s tune…It would be a wise move…The reason Bemani went to the larger MP90 supercharger is because the MP62 would not flow enough air in order to make up for the exessive volume of air needed to make 7.98psi due to the Bemani design with it’s long runs and the use of the N/A intake manifold…remember the supercharger is a pump not a compressor…
As I said there are those who will never addmit that they didn’t get what they paid for…Enjoy settling for less and at those prices…It must be nice…

Frank - You are not doing yourself any favours. Trying to pick holes in other products on the market is fine if you have anything to back them up! First you claim Bemani can�t produce the power on 6psi (they run just under 8) and they are clearly lying about their output (by law, as Bob pointed out they cant miss quote). So then you decide they cant of done 100+ cars - what the hell are you biasing this on ? - my car was no 85 from the Lotus dealer in Switzerland - not the only seller in Switzerland let alone Europe.

Sorry Frank - but with all the stuff you have achieved you would think you could come up with something more constructive. Please don�t turn this thread into another one like the wheels thread.

Would love to post the dyno of my car but it is now owned by Jason along with the car - which he seems to be enjoying just as much as me and using it as an everyday car

I have no rose tinted glasses I am quite happy to point out the faults in the Bemani product but performance and reliability are not among them!

Jammie I never said it was bad all I said was does anyone have a real dyno sheet to back up their claims, do you belive everything your told ? and as far as the wheel thing goes Guy Evens of Nitron said I could without a doubt use more rubber on my car on his visit out here…with the power I’m making…Traction more rubber not supenssion setup… I’ve had that covered a long time ago

Jammie I never said it was bad

Well, at the least, you certainly seem to have an extremely dismissive attitude of the Bemani S/C - apparently based purely on subjective evidence, judging by your comments on monkeytuner.com.

Quotes:

“Bemani the gold standard in superchargers [Rolex]…So where the [censored] are they now…”

and

“I was at Button Willow on Monday and let’s put it this way no one in a Bemani ever came close to me…or poped his deck lid to show us that blinged out “Gold Standard”…Fastest Lotus my ass…”

It would seem quite obvious that driver ability has to be considered � just 'cos you let the Bemanis eat your dust doesn’t necessarily mean that your car is more powerful! Surely the thought must have crossed your mind that you just might be a rather better than average driver? I’ve seen numerous quotes from people in tuned Lotuses at trackdays who’ve admitted that they have been blown away by a stock 118bhp S1 Elise in the hands of a competent driver � it is a huge factor.

Anyway, if you look at the road test results from independent and respected auto mags, the 0-60mph (or 0-100kmh)times for the stock 192bhp Exige, the 240R and the Bemani seem to indicate that the claimed power of the Bemani is accurate � unless you’re now going to start saying that Lotus are bullshitting too!

Whilst I would not be surprised to find that some US tuners make inflated claims, in strictly regulated Switzerland and Germany there is little scope for that. If you don’t want to believe the officially certified figures, then perhaps you could drive a Bemani yourself to compare (thus eliminating the driver variable) � or better still borrow one to dyno!

There isn’t much point in us discussing it further � it would seem that the other Bemani S/C owners are all as happy as I am with the performance. I certainly don’t need a dyno chart (unless I want document the current power prior to further mods � which isn’t my intention), maybe someone else will take this route and deliver a dyno chart � but that still doesn’t say much unless other tuners’ cars are measured at the same time on the same machine… sure you could arrange that. Might be best before making more unsubstantiated and derogatory “Fastest Lotus my ass”-style comments. It doesn’t sound very professional.

Now if you want to take things out of context feel free…It was the Bemani installer in southern cali. that called the Bemani a Rolex and all others Timex…so if your gonna post something get it right…I’m sure you could find his quote on Elise Talk.com
as for my style of speech I have no need to try and impress anyone, as this is not my profession. I do it for fun nothing more…a road test in a car mag is nothing to brag about because in the real world you could never duplicate their numbers and they don’t do dyno runs to see if the claims are the real deal…The dismissive attitude is towards BS in general…

Now if you want to take things out of context feel free…It was the Bemani installer in southern cali. that called the Bemani a Rolex and all others Timex…so if your gonna post something get it right…I’m sure you could find his quote on Elise Talk.com
as for my style of speech I have no need to try and impress anyone, as this is not my profession. I do it for fun nothing more…a road test in a car mag is nothing to brag about because in the real world you could never duplicate their numbers and they don’t do dyno runs to see if the claims are the real deal…The dismissive attitude is towards BS in general…

Actually no Frank, no one but you is taking things out of context. If your gripe with Bemani’s kit is a comment by Don at Elisetalk.com - maybe you should take up your gripes with him directly, rather than overhere at this place. I’m sure I speak for everyone here when I say that personal issues are best taken on personally.


Besides, the comment on Bemani being the ‘Rolex’ among the kits - I’m sure Don was just looking for a fitting analogy, one hinting at the high price and excellent install quality. Nothing more, nothing less. Besides, I don’t even like Rolex’s anyway.

The reason Bemani went to the larger MP90 supercharger is because the MP62 would not flow enough air in order to make up for the exessive volume of air needed to make 7.98psi due to the Bemani design with it’s long runs and the use of the N/A intake manifold…remember the supercharger is a pump not a compressor…

I’m not a expert, but my understanding of physics make this statement seem odd. Surely doesn’t make any difference how long the pipe is, adding one gallon to an already full hose pipe means one gallon comes out the other end. Air does not get lost just because the inlet is a few feet longer. Its probably more to do with pressure drop across the charge cooler, that caused by the bends and N/A inlet manifold. That might be the real reason they are running the bigger sc, as more pressure is needed to be generated. For what I have seen the water based charge cooler is smaller,so I suspect the pressure drop may be higher.

Now if you want to take things out of context feel free…It was the Bemani installer in southern cali. that called the Bemani a Rolex and all others Timex…so if your gonna post something get it right…I’m sure you could find his quote on Elise Talk.com
as for my style of speech I have no need to try and impress anyone, as this is not my profession. I do it for fun nothing more…a road test in a car mag is nothing to brag about because in the real world you could never duplicate their numbers and they don’t do dyno runs to see if the claims are the real deal…The dismissive attitude is towards BS in general…

Actually no Frank, no one but you is taking things out of context. If your gripe with Bemani’s kit is a comment by Don at Elisetalk.com - maybe you should take up your gripes with him directly, rather than overhere at this place. I’m sure I speak for everyone here when I say that personal issues are best taken on personally.


Besides, the comment on Bemani being the ‘Rolex’ among the kits - I’m sure Don was just looking for a fitting analogy, one hinting at the high price and excellent install quality. Nothing more, nothing less. Besides, I don’t even like Rolex’s anyway.

I have no gripe with Bemani I just asked why is there no “real” dyno sheet anywhere ? It’s you Bemani guys that walk around with blinders on not even wanting to dyno test to see what you got, now it can’t be because your too cheap, hell you droped $15,000+…There are real dyno test on every N/A and supercharged Lotus here and on other sites but no Bemani…

I don’t even like Rolex’s anyway.

Me neither!



Heh, Frank � if it doesn’t worry the Bemani owners that noone (except the � in your view apparently � totally insignificant, irrelevant and perhaps even unreliable?) Swiss and German Motorvehicle Testing and Approval agencies as well as some of the oldest and most respected motor journals* in the world)) has tested the car, why should it worry you?

For someone who “has no gripe with Bemani”, you do seem to seem very keen to attack them.

*That’s not bragging � such comments indicate that you are not only dismissive of Bemani but also, it would seem, just about everyone else!

I’m sure that the only way you’ll be happy is if you can do back-to-back dyno runs of the Bemani and various other cars at the same time. So, if you feel so strongly about it, why not do that and we can all get on with enjoying our cars!

So I assume you guys will belive any crap you’re told without question ? What a very noble German/Swiss thing to do…

So I assume you guys will belive any crap you’re told without question ? What a very noble German/Swiss thing to do…

Oh dear - with comments like that, I think it could be time to consign this to the Muppet Show

Oh dear - with comments like that, I think it could be time to consign this to the Muppet Show

Nah, I was enjoying this, having no direct interest in S2 matters

belive any crap you’re told

I honestly don’t think the aforementioned Swiss and German Motorvehicle Testing and Approval agencies as well as some of the oldest and most respected motor journals actually do talk “crap” when it comes to power outputs/performance.


Like I said before, why should it worry you? Perhaps it’s better if you leave it if you can only come up with retorts like that.

P.S. To be honest, even if you did do a back-to-back dyno which showed, say, that your car had 300bhp and a Bemani only 250, it wouldn’t matter to me here in Switzerland because I could never get your conversion approved - no matter how great it is � and I don’t doubt that it is good.

Unless you do the dynos yourself, you’ll never be happy anyway, will you?!

So I assume you guys will belive any crap you’re told without question ? What a very noble German/Swiss thing to do…

If that were the case they would believe your crap.

So I assume you guys will belive any crap you’re told without question ? What a very noble German/Swiss thing to do…

If that were the case they would believe your crap.

First off I’m not selling anything fool so keep your blind faith in the superior Swiss govt. dyno sheets…BS…Oh wait they don’t exist or you would have posted it by now…you can ask around on Elise Talk or Moremonkey as to how well my “crap” runs…so defensive why? Did you buy one? Oh wait I’m so sorry I asked if there was any proof of power…now did you know that the Bemani guys can retune on the fly by pluging into the OBD11 port, here in the very loose US of A…I don’t think they could do that legaly…software copy rights and all…so much for Govt. controls…

keep your blind faith in the superior Swiss govt. dyno sheets…BS…Oh wait they don’t exist or you would have posted it by now…

Now that simply is not a reasonable argument! The official testing agencies don’t have to give us owners a copy of their dyno tests!

I notice that you haven’t responed to my point that, even if someone did post a dyno, it would not really say much unless other cars were tested at the same time on the same machine. Or don’t you agree?

Please note that it is you who is being very dismissive and mudslinging with words like "crap " and “BS” without any reasonable grounds. Basically, you are acusing Bemani owners of sticking their heads in the sand and imply that we are simply imagining the ugraded performance � the fact that this has been tested and the figures published by renowned, independent testers seem to leave you cold � or do you not believe them either? It seems to me that you are the one who is sticking their head in the sand� and it is starting to look rather silly.

As I said in the begining “postem if ya gotem”…every other guy who cares about performance mods has…I know you don’t care but I’m sure there are guys out there that don’t post that do…So for $15,000+ you get what?

keep your blind faith in the superior Swiss govt. dyno sheets…BS…Oh wait they don’t exist or you would have posted it by now…

Now that simply is not a reasonable argument! The official testing agencies don’t have to give us owners a copy of their dyno tests!

I notice that you haven’t responed to my point that, even if someone did post a dyno, it would not really say much unless other cars were tested at the same time on the same machine. Or don’t you agree?

Please note that it is you who is being very dismissive and mudslinging with words like "crap " and “BS” without any reasonable grounds. Basically, you are acusing Bemani owners of sticking their heads in the sand and imply that we are simply imagining the ugraded performance � the fact that this has been tested and the figures published by renowned, independent testers seem to leave you cold � or do you not believe them either? It seems to me that > you > are the one who is sticking their head in the sand� and it is starting to look rather silly.

I’m not asking for a dyno shoot out, who cares what day and air temps, all I said was does anyone have a “real” dyno sheet and can the post it so that those who care can see things like torque curves, cam change points and A/F ratios…As for the "fastest Lotus " quote that comes from the Bemani web page…so wipe that sand from your head and postem

I’m not asking for a dyno shoot out, who cares what day and air temps

I rather suspect that you do as, if you aren’t prepared to accept Bemani’s chart, then you would also want to pick holes in any other data offered… admit it!



As for the "fastest Lotus " quote that comes from the Bemani web page

And was posted in early 2005. The Bemani kit is certainly still the fastest � in Europe, at least and, AFAIK, no-one is officially importing any kits from anywhere else and �even if they did � they would not be street-legal here!




wipe that sand from your head and postem

No sand on my head. The fact that, in highly regulated Switzerland, I can drive an Exige Cup with a Bemani S/C on the road completely legally is a dream come true. I’ve got no charts and, you know what? I really don’t care, as I know I’ve got the best I can get here!

Make of this what you will but, if you do ever get the chance, please do dyno a Bemani and some other cars at the same time. I’ll be happy to believe your figures.

At the moment I feel that any further discussion is pointless, so I won’t bother responding again in this thread � no matter how ludicrously and unfoundedly provocative any further posts may be!

Hope you enjoy your car � I certainly enjoy mine