Cones - yep, good point. Will someone please remind me in future to ask Jonny to make sure they’re out?
I think with the S1 you have a light(er) car with more downforce than S2’s.
Remove more weight, add more downforce, some ‘race tuned’ dampers/springs, figure hugging seats & harnesses, uprated brakes, and a heap more power couryesy of Honda or Audi and you will automatically be faster than any standard car.
RussT had a spell driving my S2 & the speed he carried through some corners was noticably way quicker than me.
Practice & tuition is the cheapest & most enjoyable route, then upgrades
I preferred without cones tbh although can see the benefit for some folks.
With no cones it forces you to improve your vision in general and use other circuit references (ideally immovable). Can be a bit too easy to focus on cones as a single reference point (then you’re buggered if it’s not there or someone ‘moves’ it).
[quote=alicrozier]I preferred without cones tbh although can see the benefit for some folks.
With no cones it forces you to improve your vision in general and use other circuit references (ideally immovable). Can be a bit too easy to focus on cones as a single reference point (then you’re buggered if it’s not there or someone ‘moves’ it). [/quote]
Probably true if you have done a few trackdays but when you are a newbie they really help, it took me an age to start getting into the swing of things without them (that was my fourth TD).
[quote=Boothy][quote=alicrozier]I preferred without cones tbh although can see the benefit for some folks.
With no cones it forces you to improve your vision in general and use other circuit references (ideally immovable). Can be a bit too easy to focus on cones as a single reference point (then you’re buggered if it’s not there or someone ‘moves’ it). [/quote]
Probably true if you have done a few trackdays but when you are a newbie they really help, it took me an age to start getting into the swing of things without them (that was my fourth TD). [/quote]
Helps if the track has some feaatures to actually use as reference points ;O)
[quote=DSE]
Helps if the track has some feaatures to actually use as reference points ;O)[/quote]
Such as women stood on the banking???
My guide to going fast
Practice
Horse Power
The End!!
Seriously though, I think, you need to practice and practice until you get consistent (lots of tuition helps here)
Then make the car fit your driving style. I see too many people who think there car wont go round corners because of there driving. When once you are consistant, you should be tweaking the dampers and geo and setup to get the car to do what you want it to do.
I have spent 3 years getting my car right, my dampers have probably been re-sprung and re-valved about half a dozen times, plus the ride height, front and rear toe and cambers have all been tweaked to get the car to feel how i want it.
Basically my car gives me so much feedback and confidence that I do feel a bit invinsible in it, and on a dry day with my head in the right palce, it is Uber fast!
At Anglesey i tweaked the bump and rebound about three times as the track dried and i got more into it.
One size does not fit all!!
Plus dampers need overhauling and rebuilding. They take a right pounding and in my opinion should be refreshed at least every two years. All of the popular brnads can be serviced and rebuilt for very little money.
Just my 2p
1 - Tuition and Practise
2 - Lack of horsepower
Anyone can go out and buy horsepower, and to a certain extent it will make you reasonably fast… but it will also make it harder to learn to be properly quick in my opinion.
Learn to push your car to the limits, then improve the handling (suspension/rollbars/tyres) and then learn to push the new limits.
A standard well setup S1 elise that’s driven well will lap in very respectable times and be a match for far higher powered cars on track.
Having an ultra high powered car too early is only going to hinder your progress IMO… sure, you’ll overtake stuff, but it will quite possibly get you into trouble at some stage too, as when you do have a ‘moment’ (which you will when you start pushing) you’ll be going a lot quicker and have less time to deal with it.
Spot on Dave. With less horsepower you can take more liberties and get away with it. Give you the confidence to be ‘flat’ without it catching you out.
[quote=evo_ufo][quote=DaveP]
1 - Tuition and Practise
2 - Lack of horsepower
Anyone can go out and buy horsepower, and to a certain extent it will make you reasonably fast… but it will also make it harder to learn to be properly quick in my opinion.
Learn to push your car to the limits, then improve the handling (suspension/rollbars/tyres) and then learn to push the new limits.
A standard well setup S1 elise that’s driven well will lap in very respectable times and be a match for far higher powered cars on track.
Having an ultra high powered car too early is only going to hinder your progress IMO… sure, you’ll overtake stuff, but it will quite possibly get you into trouble at some stage too, as when you do have a ‘moment’ (which you will when you start pushing) you’ll be going a lot quicker and have less time to deal with it.
[/quote]
Spot on Dave. With less horsepower you can take more liberties and get away with it. Give you the confidence to be ‘flat’ without it catching you out. [/quote]
This is it, I spoke with Will I think at the end of my first year and what he told me and what Dave has written is spot on. Every year I can feel myself getting quicker although I am not necessarily consistent. I�m finding that I am learning tracks with or without cones but not having to work so hard each time, I keep forgetting little bits like line, an apex, entry, gear and so on. Cones were a God send as a newbie but now I find myself better picking out my own reference points and it�s getting easier with each TD, as a matter of fact even when they are there, they�re not if you know what I mean?
I know early last year I met with JFK at Donny when the weather was iffy and I hadn�t got the balls to drive that quick in it where as on a very dry day later in the year with full tuition I believe I finally nailed it and as a matter of fact was told to try for my race licence (that felt good lol)��…same with OP later in the year but not so much at Anglesey sadly. I�m quicker and more consistent the longer the day goes on and I�m quicker at being more consistent the more I visit the track�…a lot has to be said for confidence at this point. The margin for error is getting smaller the quicker I go but my car control and ability to correct is getting quicker also. So is my composure when in those situations as I�m able to recover and move on instantly without batting an eye lid.
Set up like tuition is massively important I swear by my Ohlin dampers as much as I swear by tuition, it�s all about practise breading confidence imho.
Agree aswel. Low power is a good thing to get your skills up.
My experience from a few track day’s and from my work is that people tend to go into corners too early and too fast, usually running in to problems at the exit point. Try braking late and longer. Then have a late turn in, apex and full power out. Its usually a lot more faster and safer as you have plenty of space out of the corner.
Having fun and bringing home a healthy car is main thing though.
That could be a quote from Mike Wildes
I had some instruction from Howie and asked him how I could really move my driving on and his reply…“Get a slower car”
Bit late for that, and at the end of the day I have a lot of fun. In reality my car and my skill level have probably evolved at about the same rate - read the gulf between the car’s capabilities and my own has stayed constant
The fast in and sort it out later method is entertaining usually, however the Mike Wildes/decent instructor version does feel miles better & easier on the car when (on the odd occasion) i get it right.
My car is way better than me also
I did notice a huge benefit from the two mods I made after Oulton.
The PF brake pads were great and gave a consistent feel and significantly more bite. This paid off on the run up to Radar and the main hairpin.
The Ohlins brought much more control and dispensed with the wooly feeling of the standard dampers. To get more out of the Ohlins did require some changes. I started with a conservative setting on the compression of +12 but firmed that up to +4 and I felt the difference was significant in reducing roll with no side effects. But unfortunately major damage had already occurred - my mudflaps have rubbed through . I really need to fit a stiffer anti roll bar, then I can probably back off the bump settings a little.
I’m a bit limited in reducing the ride height any further as I need the ground clearance and suspension travel for rough tarmac and jumps! Fitting the undertray and diffuser should help the aero , I had them off at Angelsey as I’m making a sump guard.
It’s early days with the car and there’s still plenty to come from the chassis setup and certainly a lot more from the driver, especially in the wet. I was actually happy to see a wet track in the morning as it was an opportunity to work on finding grip and limits. I don’t have an LSD fitted - yet, the weird thing was that I missed it more in the dry than the wet. The inside wheel was consistently lighting up on exiting both hairpins and radar, again a better anti roll bar should tame some of that.
I’ve just done a spanner check on the 4 corners of the car. The front A048 M’s were new for Angelsey but they won’t be doing many more miles now. They have slightly heavier wear towards the outer edges probably suggesting I need to run some more negative camber up front which is no suprise.
From my point of view it’s part of the fun improving the setup of the car and learning as you go. As others have said consistency and practice make a big difference. Without that it’s hard to tell if your mods are really paying off.
Looking at my footage whilst at home I feel that I was merely cruising … I was changing up at 7000 rpm and not adopting my style of last year (sliding and finding limits)
This is not representative of me and has me scratching my head as to why…
Excellent point from Pesky,in that there is the safety net of insurance …
I was quicker (i felt) last year than this year , this was in spite of now having much more power… The reason ? … Last year , pre-recession I was not thinking about financial consequences of a prang … This year I was !
Re setup … I have to put my hands up and say right now that my experience of setup is limited to changing front to rear tyre pressures and adding a diff…(thats all my 80’s cars were tuneable with)… Geo, to me is completely new, as is bump/rebound/fart settings!!
(Wes I completely agree on the LSD)
I’d love to read a complete chassis setup guide by someone such as Sean who has built and evolved with an Exige… ??
And if anyone wants to go for a few UK records in paragliding I can help you out there (flying is so straightforward)