I agree with Russ in as much as I think the arguments can be distracting and take threads way off topic. Howver I do like reading the banter if I am honest, although I have no interetst in being involved in it.
What I think would be nice is if the person who owns the thread (the thread starter) could delete individual posts from that thread if they think they are not relevant to the thread.
Sean…
I’ve sent a pm to David to ask him to mediate and sort this out. This was after seeing Simon post the following comment.
- but what’s this about seeing hundreds of failed engines ? - a confession??
There was no need for that comment and t was designed purely to cause another argument and get a reaction from Dave, and it worked.
What was ironic was in my PM to David I effectively said that Simon will make a comment to get a reaction like this and will then complain he is the one being abused.
Cue a couple of posts later in response to Cons comment.
Please can we remain on track here guys.
Those of us who are less qualified mechanically really enjoy reading and learning from your “gentlemanly” posts.
Thank you.The more people stand up and take issue with all the personal abuse the better
Certainly something needs to be done, otherwise the boards will die, they are certainly not as busy as they used to be already. I certainly don’t want to see anyone banned, and personally i would like to see Randy and Scuffers allowed back as well, but the abuse, little digs to get a reaction etc need to stop. Otherwise I think it is time for others to get banned.
What I think would be nice is if the person who owns the thread (the thread starter) could delete individual posts from that thread if they think they are not relevant to the thread.
Sean…
Sean et al
All that is needed is for participants to use simple, good old fashioned, manners, when posting here. There should never be any requirement for threads to be moderated - by anyone!
Anyone who has attended exiges.com trackdays/LOT Races/Mid engined Series etc, knows the full extent of the camaraderie amongst many owners. It just really doesn’t matter what powers the car - we respect each other’s choice, & proceed to gladly help & support one another, as & when required. Of course there’s competitiveness, but it is controlled by self moderation.
It’s obvious to anyone who has followed these threads over the past 3 years, where the root of the “problem” lies, & it’s now long overdue for everyone to move forward with respect for one another, whilst, quite rightly, being able to politely discuss points of dissagreement.
Personally, I don’t want to see anyone banned, but I’m sick & tired of hearing the abuse.
Well, that’s my opinion for what it’s worth.
Simon,
Any abuse is not acceptable, and for that reason everyone involved needs to stop.
What I take offence at from yourself is the fact that you have done a number of times what you have done in this thread, that is to start off with a reasoned debate, but when someone disagrees with you you make some sort of little comment or dig which is designed to cause a reaction. Then when the normal abuse kicks off and people ask for calm you claim to be the abused person, and at times you are, but a lot of the time you bring it on yourself.
There was no need for the comment you made in this thread, just as there is no need for a lot of the comments you make.
yes the King Dick and King Tosser comments get a bit much and aren’t even funny so the others need to take some of the blame, but the instigator of most of the grief is from yourself.
I’m not partisan to anyone, just have a look through the forums here and SELOC and you’ll see I disagree with most of you protaganists as well at times.
EVERYONE needs to take a step back look at what they are doing otherwise I think Russ’s suggestion is the best plan.
Simon,
Any abuse is not acceptable, and for that reason everyone involved needs to stop.
What I take offence at from yourself is the fact that you have done a number of times what you have done in this thread, that is to start off with a reasoned debate, but when someone disagrees with you you make some sort of little comment or dig which is designed to cause a reaction. Then when the normal abuse kicks off and people ask for calm you claim to be the abused person, and at times you are, but a lot of the time you bring it on yourself.
There was no need for the comment you made in this thread, just as there is no need for a lot of the comments you make.
yes the King Dick and King Tosser comments get a bit much and aren’t even funny so the others need to take some of the blame, but the instigator of most of the grief is from yourself.
I’m not partisan to anyone, just have a look through the forums here and SELOC and you’ll see I disagree with most of you protaganists as well at times.
EVERYONE needs to take a step back look at what they are doing otherwise I think Russ’s suggestion is the best plan.
Here Here… well said I like reading the technical post and differeing people opinions but there is no need for playground name calling
Hello all,
discussions like these are one of the reasons that keep me away (and I guess some of you will not miss me)
But from where I see this, the dig started here:
Try reading the post.
Dave obviously doesn’t understand Simon’s point, and then Simon retorts with the (mildly amusing but stingy) comment.
It all goes downhill from there.
Obviously Dave and Simon will never get along, but the banter killed itself there.
There was no need for Mark’s post (although I liked Russ’ one )
As I see it, for all the times Simon has been directly called names, you guys need to tolerate more than a silly confession reference (which didn’t even make complete sense, more like an attempt to a joke).
I say to Simon: would you please keep the jokes to a minimum? obviously these guys are never going to take even a light remark from you, they’re already having a hard time refraining from calling you names!
I say to Dave, would you please acknowledge the fact that there may be another opinion? Simon had got your point and he was passing on his opinion on what may have happened, no need to tell him he obviously doesn’t understand.
And to Mark and others, when you see the banter starting, why not just refrain from any additional remarks? like a match, it will extinguish itself in a minute if not fed.
Just continue with the thread taking in only the technical details.
I will now crawl back under my rock…
I will now crawl back under my rock…
Not for too long, I hope, amigo
Hope to see you out & about again next year
PS How’s Rox - any news? (Prob best to pm me rather than post on this thread).
Russ - nice offers but I think that you have missed the obvious choice of having a moderator or two. Perhaps that is because you don’t think that that is a good idea. regarding a separate site - I thought the Muppet zone was exactly for that.
Pesky’s camp is that the site should not need moderation, other than that of the poster themselves. However, I think that a moderator or two would be beneficial to the site as long as they handled things with a light touch. i think that there is a lot of value in what Simon and Dave have to say and offer but frequently I would have liked the opportuinty to delete parts of postings when they go off into the personal attack/defence mode. The latter would not be necessary if the offending words were moderated - which is i think the point well made by Mark.
I also agree that Randy & Scuffers should be allowed back into the site - assuming that they would want to contribute!
At the end of the day, the site is Dave’s and we owe him a debt for setting it up in the first place, but perhaps it is time to move it on a bit - what about nominating two or three moderators with an initial 3 month tenure. Then review whether they are needed after that period?
Steve et al
I am 100% dead set against having “moderators” on exiges.com. If they are needed, there’s something very wrong, & if that is the case, then I really don’t want to stay. You just have to look at Seloc to see what happens when moderators have to get involved because people can’t behave sensibly.
This forum is not an extension of the activities of a formal club of members, & in my opinion exiges.com should never become a formal club.
Most people here have enough too do without the added stress/aggravation of acting as moderator - a thankless task, if ever there was one! Also, to be totally fair to David Admin, he should not have be burdened with being the sole arbiter. Fortunately, he has rarely seen it necessary to take action, since he founded this forum 7 years ago.
I don’t think for one minute Scuffers or Randy are interested in returning, but I could be wrong. I personally would appreciate their views on various matters being available for all to see. However, if David does not feel that is appropriate for HIS forum, then that is 100% fine by me.
As I said in another recent post, we can’t turn back the clock, but we can influence the future.
There was no need for Mark’s post (although I liked Russ’ one )
My post was initially in response to Russ’s request for people to comment. And I’m fed up with the grief from both sides.
As I see it, for all the times Simon has been directly called names, you guys need to tolerate more than a silly confession reference (which didn’t even make complete sense, more like an attempt to a joke).
Perhaps you haven’t read a lot of the threads recently but unfortunately this is a similar style to a number of previous threads which were going well, yes there is the odd off comment but it ultimately goes downhill by a direct comment, unfortunately it’s usually Simon having a pop at someone, but not exclusively. And yes the name calling is pretty pathetic.
I say to Simon: would you please keep the jokes to a minimum? obviously these guys are never going to take even a light remark from you, they’re already having a hard time refraining from calling you names!
Jokes I don’t mind but like some others Simons comments to me and others have gone way beyond that.
However I am not interested in dragging it all up again and to me it’s ancient history.
All I want is to try and help keep things civil and truthful on the forums.
And to Mark and others, when you see the banter starting, why not just refrain from any additional remarks? like a match, it will extinguish itself in a minute if not fed.
Just continue with the thread taking in only the technical details.
I will now crawl back under my rock…
I’ll be honest Uldis, yourself and Rox are some of the people who are missing on this forum and although I’ve never met you (but have met Rox) I would like to see you and him posting again, but you also have to acknowledge that it’s abuse from both sides not just people having a pop at Simon. It’s only when EVERYONE stops acting like spoilt children that things will improve. Personally I agree with Russ in that the more people who say it’s unacceptable the more chance there is of stopping it.
Totally agree with Uldis, nice to hear you’re still up and running matey - sensible, informative threads rapidly deteriorate into personal invective and protecting interests.
Main reason got into Exiging was this forum when it used to be a user friendly to post - some of best guys I have ever met reside here.
Become a lurker rather than a poster these days - but still own the best budget supercar ever, ever built
Uldis - welcome back I hope you & the other scottish exigers are well
RussT - spot on.
Hey Uldis, hope you are well. Give my regards to Rox if you talk to him.
Alternatively, David, would you consider selling exiges.com?
To what end ?
It causes me no grief, earns me no money (other than pin money to run it) and I don’t perceive it as having a value to make it worth selling.
I don’t think setting up K-series-bunfight.com would solve anything either (as amusing as it sounds !)
Still, I hope this entire issue can now be laid to bed
Anyone who has attended exiges.com trackdays/LOT Races/Mid engined Series etc, knows the full extent of the camaraderie amongst many owners. It just really doesn’t matter what powers the car - we respect each other’s choice, & proceed to gladly help & support one another, as & when required. Of course there’s competitiveness, but it is controlled by self moderation.
One of the truest comments on this thread. Everyone I have met through either exiges or LoT - SeanB, Pesky, Maddog, RussT and too many others to name are all top people. There is a great competitive spirit, but also a great spirit of helping one another out. There is no aggro between competitors as to who has what engine etc. Noone is pleased to see others having problems and only too willing to help when they do.
That spirit of cooperation has shone through every meet I have attended and ironically if everyone on forums in general posted with the same spirit that is there for all to see in the real world, there would never be any need for moderation.
Simon Erland is a very decent chap who has helped me personally on many occasions. So too is Dave Andrews who, though I have never met in person, has gone out of his way to help me and too many others to count over the years. I have the utmost respect for the work they have done, together with the other engine developers. I fully acknowledge the angry words that have been exchanged all round on the forums and as many have said, there should never have been any need to denigrate others to make one’s own point. Someone else doesn’t have to be wrong for one’s own viewpoint to have merit.
I remain in the hope that the many harsh words said over the years can be put into the past and we can all remember why we have this mutual enthusiasm for motorsport and the lotus marque.
Couldn`t agree more
I know what went wrong now
What?
I guess since Simon has been banned we’re kinda reliant on you to let us know !