After the threads regarding the brakes on the S2 and issues people had been having with them I thought I post some comments after two long days at Spa.
Firstly it was dry so track speeds were very high in my 240R proving to be quicker than all of the Porsche there and faster than two Radicals (who must have been slow drivers as we all know they should be faster!) and on the second day playing tag with Mark in his flame spitting Honda powered S1 Exige.
I used four tanks of fuel over the two days just on track so I must have done 50ish laps at my calculations and can say conclusively that I had no issues with the brakes at all, peddle feel remained consistent, no brake fade and no overheating pad issues.
Just thought I’d share as when I left for Spa which I view as a brake killer circuit as there are several 120+ mph braking zones into very slow corners I was concerned from other comments that the brakes wouldn’t cope. Happily they did perfectly.
Having not done Spa I can’t comment on specifics about cooling times (longer distances between heavey brake use). I’m pleased that you didn’t have any problems though, could have been a right PITA if you had.
I know that Donington is the only track that I’ve tried in this car, and that both times I’ve had problems. This may be related to the circuit layout, with 4-5 heavey braking corners in reasonably quick succession (national circuit), all from about 120 down to about 40-60mph. God knows what the GP circuit would do to them…
There’s a chap in Germany who posted on SELOC about the same issues I’m having, and it seems that this is not that uncommon. I wonder if it’s your more open wheels could be helping with the cooling?
I’ve done Silverstone twice, Brands Indy and Abbeville as well without issues so I would guess that the very open design of the wheels on the 240R does make just enough difference to make them survive ok??
I’m just getting a second set of wheels so I have a set of wets available (if Spa had been it’s normal self I’d have had a frustrating couple of days). Lotus are confirming the prices but looks like �1600+vat per set… ouch…
I did the Toyo tyres road saloon championship a few years ago in a Sunbeam… know its not really a comparison, but my brakes were fine on all circuits except Donington… I boiled my brake fluid and the discs were smoking big time after the race…
Sounds like everyone here is very expereinced but is the difference likely to be down to braking style? and the size of your nuts?
What is the racing spec…do they up the standard brakes? to AP’s, change the disks or/and the calipers or something?
Some of you may have followed my thread on SELOC (AP Disks and alternative brake set up) so will know that the horror continues.
Further to the 2 failures at Donington, a third set of new disk and pads was fitted to the car, under warrantee.
This time Lotus sent a field engineer and also an engineer from AP Racing Brakes (who manufacture the standard disks). they took the car for a test drive then measured everything before replacing the disks and pads.
The disks were found to be out of tollerance, and were taken away by AP for further testing, along with the first set. I’ve still not had the results of these tests.
I then attended a further trackday at Rockingham (my local circuit) on Monday. I invited Lotus to attend, but they could not.
Once again the brakes failed in the same way as before. This time they lasted just 32 laps (83 miles), carried out in 4 seasons of about 15 minutes. They had been bedded in properly prior to the trackday, having covered 433 road miles.
As you may understand, my patiance has now well and truely run out. After 3 months of the same problem, and not having completed one trackday, this “road car ready for track use straight out of the box” is now being returned to the dealer, rejected as not fit for purpose.
Does anyone have any experience of rejecting a car, and I could do with a good solicitor with experience in this area. I have spoken to a couple but not engage one yet, I think the time is now here when one is needed.
Any advice on what I should look for in solicitor? I’ve not had much experience in this area…
I’m really sorry to hear this. Most people agree the standard disks are rubbish, but they’re generally expected to last better than that. I think it’s a shame (but I fully understand why) you’ve given up on the car after you’ve gone to some trouble to get the problem addressed. It would be a shame to have given up the car if Lotus/AP come up with a good explanation and a fix for this problem in the near future.
As you are a paid up member of SELOC talk to Strees on there (or on MLOC) as he is the legal adviser. I think paid up membership gives you access to a legal hotline.
Not yet. Probably a Caterham R400 race car and trailer. Possibly a Radical, or a GT3 RS if funds allow. Always fancied a 355, and with prices falling this may be the time.
Won’t be another Lotus though. I’ve totally lost faith in the engineering integrity of Lotus. If there willing to skimp on the safety critical brakes, what other corners may have been cut in the build of this car?
Won’t be another Lotus though. I’ve totally lost faith in the engineering integrity of Lotus. If there willing to skimp on the safety critical brakes, what other corners may have been cut in the build of this car?
Hmmm…maybe best to wait for the test results first. Reading your post it appears the manufacturer & part supplier are endeavouring to sort your problem. Your ‘unfit for purpose’ route is unlikely to succeed until th ecause is found. Don’t forget that other owners out there may have used their cars similarly to you but without this issue. I understand your frustration though.
I can’t imagine you’d enjoy the same degree of reliability or running cost using a 355 instead of the Lotus
Didn’t read the whole thread because I’m not going to a dumpster like Seloc.
Still, I am assuming you’re talking about a new S2 and some sort of Lotus-approved AP upgrade?
Anyway, the S1 is more of a track car than the S2 is, most here would agree.
Still, within 2000 miles of ROAD use (from new) I managed to obliterate my brakes, they got replaced 3 times on warranty by Lotus and when asked if it was worth to keep on changing them with similar bits or upgrading to aftermarket parts I was told that the warranty would be lost if I did that.
I chose the aftermarket route, because Lotus is a business, not really a race team (at least not the one that sells you the car). They’re only interested on making money so they’ll spec the cars with the most cost effective solution that meets 80% of the users. The other 20% will have to sort it out some other way.
You could go to Lotus MS and ask them for a real upgrade, or just ask around what others have done, or just work it out yourself.
But any brand you buy would be the same in that sense, surely Porker and Ferrari, as a commercial practice they don’t really support track users.
Maybe you could have some luck with Radical?
I accepted some time ago that NOBODY will sell you the best spec/tech/product for reasonable money. Businesses don’t function like that.
You want the top? You’ll have to pay. Dearly. Or invent a solution.
Even full race tems break parts and actually help in the development.
Nobody gives you everything for a std price.
Sorry.
I think it’s pretty promising that Lotus are taking this fairly seriously, getting AP involved in checking your brake disks. Speaking from past experience with Lotus, it makes complete comercial sense for them to keep quiet on the matter under investigation. They will admit nothing, and tell you very little about the nature of any problem or proposed solution until they are absolutely sure of how they want to progress with the matter. They certainly wont rush to upgrade any parts until they know exactly why there’s a problem and whether they have a fix that doesn’t cause some other issues further down the line.
I would be inclined to wait and see what they come back with.
I doubt you will find ANY production road car that will stand up to serious track use much better than the Exige.
I was told that the warranty would be lost if I did that. I got that response as well. >
You could go to Lotus MS and ask them for a real upgrade. Lotus Motorsport built the car specifically for RACE use. There is no difference between the race car and the road version.
You want the top? You’ll have to pay. Dearly. I did, �45.5K, The Lotus flagship model with NO other upgrades being available… >
Don’t forget that other owners out there may have used their cars similarly to you but without this issue.
I’ve no doubt that owners can be found that have not experienced this problem, but I’m also getting emails from others who have, and are now following the same route as me with warrantee claims being meet in the same way.
I’ve also spoken to an Exige S owner who has had the start of what appeared to be the same problem. >