2.3L Brand new engines available for 1600 quid incl … makes you think a bit
Andy
Is that from a Ford dealer? Presumably, starter motor, alternator, oil pump etc are additional?
Ta in advance.
Pesky !
Thats a brand new undressed engine from USA - so yep alternator, starter etc are extra - and I think you need to change the sump pan as the 2.3L is from the Ranger “SUV” and so a bit truck like ( in other words its deep ) -
2.0L are about the same price, so what Geary is saying adds up, the stock 2.3 is aimed more for torque and less “revability” so would change the nature of the car a bit.
However, if you want to make a 250hp 180ft/ibs reliable 2.1L engine the 2.3 is the right place to start I am told
Hmm? I like revs. But I do also like a thump in the back.
Any idea on weight over the K?
Ian
However, if you want to make a 250hp 180ft/ibs reliable 2.1L engine the 2.3 is the right place to start I am told
Only problem is the PG-1 gearbox used on the conversion (i.e. current Exige/Elise) gearbox is only rated to 210Nm (157ft/lbs)
Oh I didn’t know that! As I’m not the biggest fan of the existing box, even with a quick shift, it’d been something that turned me off the Duratec, evidently with good reason!
Ian
Mark
Any figures on Quaifes 5 or 6 speed boxes ? - I guess the Helical is less than the SC gears though …
Well it highlights the importance of considering the whole package with conversions … having been there with very high power Minis I know ( how much extra cost transmission components can be )
So the Honda route ( with gearbox), whilst looking expensive from day one MAY be cheaper at day … er well the day you leave the PG1 gearbox all over the track
Good to get all the facts together …
Having said that … how would you get 250HP and associated “thump” from a Honda unit at what cost and would its gearbox/diff take it
Ian
You would have revs and thump - but that means a steel crank ( for durability), longer (steel) rods and decent pistons - getting back to a squarer ratio.
Weight wise using a ligtweight alternater, starter, flywheel you can get about the same as the “K”.
How many gearboxes have you heard about that have just blown? i bet the answer is ZERO
TT keep the same box with there conversions and that has >200 ft lbs pushed through it!
At the end of day i guess its all down to what YOU want, high revs then a honda engine, great torque and drivabilty then the duratec.
The quaife 6 speed on a tuned K is awesome, and when you get into tuning who cares about reliabilty too much, its the thrill of grabbing a few extra ft lbs/bhp here and there, the K is still cheap to rebuild and the scholar block with the laguna liners and a tungstan weighted/balanced crank sounds very inviting
AndyD,
Don’t know on the Quaffe as Rover don’t make it.
Phil,
Depends what you class as blown up. The design limit I quoted was given to me by the gearbox designers at Rover so very confident the figures are real, as these are tested to destruction, so yes heard of a few that have gone pop. The gearbox in my old S160 was right on the edge of going pop before I had lots of internal bits replaced, and I had the parts checked and they were on their last legs. The 210Nm is the safe limit, yes cars can run with more, but they won’t last, they may last 20-30k miles or they may last 5k miles (or less), depends on the use.
There is quite a discussion going on on the SELOC forums on this (partially fueled by me), and some comments on the TT cars, the concensus (except Simon S;)) seems to be that Davids car was the only one driven properly, most other TT cars are not overly stressed. (Judging by some of them I’ve seen on trackdays I can believe this).
Brannan’s TT was driven hard! Even popped a toe-link at Anglesey to prove it (cue the Edwards boys the the rescue, they put the A-Team to shame! ).
Ian
Mark
Actually what those figures mean is the box is almost on the limit even if your just tweaking the VHPD to get the absolute best out of it - which is interesting …
So what we arrive at is how you use it is going to determine its life … ( which can be said for everything really )
Oh no I’m gonna get into debate on how Exiges are driven and that wasn’t the point at all
The point was … er - Stock new Duratecs are cheap
And stock Duratecs are okay as far as the G’box is concerned, it just becomes a problem if you start tuning it.
Lifted from Powertrains website
"PG1 Gearbox is a five-speed constant mesh gearbox, which employs helical gears for speed transmission and final drive.
PG1 Transmission
The transmission casings are of a full aluminium construction and all other components optimised for improved weight. (37kg dry).
The gearbox can be supplied with either a standard open differential or a Limited Slip Differential presently Torsen, the name which is derived from TORque SENsing.
Due to the modular design of the gearbox various final drive ratio and 1st to 5th gear ratio combinations have been used. Including both present and past an overall total of 21 ratio combinations, 5 speedometer gear ratios; and 7 clutch lever designs for both hydraulic and cable operation can be called on to ensure the customers requirements are met.
The gearbox in its two types of standard (rated to 216Nm) and uprate (rated to 240Nm) is presently supplied to various companies including MG Rover, Land Rover, Honda and Lotus for vehicles such as Rover 25 and 45, MGF, MG ZR, MG ZS, Land Rover Freelander and Lotus Elise"
So Marks info is spot on and it is torque that kills teh gearbox … so …
So Marks info is spot on and it is torque that kills teh gearbox … so …
…Honda?!
Now, what they rated to?
Ian
Latest info on the Duratec here .
So, who’s going to be the first one to install one?
Certainly thorough, and I’d have to say, sounds convincing/interesting (bugger!).
Ian
yep, sounds good and if I was in the mood for a swap, I would prefer this to the rised up one but still can’t see the point when you have a slightly souped up VHPD and it hasn’t gone bang…
laters,
B
me too Bruno…