[quote=chrisexigegt][quote=Jonson]So is one way to look at this:
The uprated a/a intercoolers don’t reduce intake temps, but will allow air to pass at a greater rate for that same temperature?? Which would explain performance benefits on tuned cars.
Anyway, where can you buy an intercooler shroud that will take air from side scoops for sensible money? 
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This may explain why the gap between the standard & Forge coolers was bigger at Spa when compared between a 240 & my 260 car.
By simple deduction if Sean’s car had been running 260 at Spa with the std cooler the temp would have been even higher.
So what we are deducing is that fitting a uprated I/C to a std car does fook all and you only get the benefit of the better I/C’s as the power increases.
Maybe we should retest my 260 car with the std cooler V the Forge and that might give us more info ?
Happy to give that a go at Donny in October 
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Could be , I would of thought Redtec and Marston should know what there talking about or at least I should give them chance to prove the theory .
[quote=series_one]
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That exactly illustrates what I was trying to put in words (earlier post)…
what air you get IN is harder to get OUT…
If I remember correctly from my air exams the outlet aperture has to be roughly twice the size of the inlet aperture to optimise airflow…
Hence rear panel removal being so effective…Eh Frankie ??
Btw I have a 2.9 inch pulley , so a fair bit more boost , how much more heat is generated from that extra boost I don’t know , another thing that should be tested.
[quote=moomin]Btw I have a 2.9 inch pulley , so a fair bit more boost , how much more heat is generated from that extra boost I don’t know , another thing that should be tested.
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I saw at least 10 degrees increase over similar conditions when I swapped from standard pulley to 2.9
if however you are increasing the boost and power of the car there comes a point where the large air delivery of an improved intercooler will lead to much higher power gains given in comparison to the stable temperatures of the charge cooler and there you have to make your choice and pay your money and a hole different argument starts that i don’t have time to answer lol
Yeah he’s the expert … The reason for the dense bar/plate is to slow the air mass down in order for it to spend enough time in the cooler to transfer its heat, if it has zero restriction it will not transfer and not cool off… This is the problem with the barrel A/W chargecoolers Lotus used and I told them so… My temps were so much lower than theirs that they didn’t believe it until it was tested… :whistle:
Now when you make the core dense you will have a pressure drop of 1- 6 psi. but you can correct for that with shorter manifold runs and higher boost levels…
At 6-8 psi. you really don’t have much heat that can’t be tuned out with higher octane fuel and timing…Now turn up the boost and its another story…
My chargecooler setup pulls 220f+ out of my charge air temps and is better than any A/A setup out there even front mount so I’ve been told by Mitch Pederson former head tuner for AEM, after 200 pulls on the dyno and hundreds of desert road miles tunin. My EGT’s don’t even rise until I have it floored for 8 sec. 1020f cruise to 1500f at 32 psi. Intake temps stay within 15f of ambient…
Unless the core is packed in salted ice water you won’t get a cooler charge temp.
Remember as Lotus stated with the early S2 Esprit a chargecooler will be 4.5 times more effective than a A/A of the same size…
Big chargecooler huge drops in temps. Ehh but what do I know…
[video:youtube]- YouTube[/video]
After 75 dyno pulls. Any time someone wants to put their money where their mouth is as to who has the better cooler I’m here… 
A/A in an Exige are useless…
[quote=series_one]
Short summary of Keiths answer:
Higher boost would show different results, ceteris paribus.
Therefore:
Moomins intercooler should be more effective in his car than in Seans. So smile, and turn up the boost even more
And summary of test observations:
**- Intercooler size increase is only worthwhile with increased boost.
- More ducting improves efficiency regardless of state of tune.**
Simple, no? [/quote]
Dead Simple but makes no sense at all to me, more boost creates more heat so if your IC cannot get rid of a small amount of heat created by lower boost how can that same IC remove more heat from higher boost?
It will simply overheat faster…
To me this comes down to how effective something is in the low airflow position offered by the exige rather than front mounted.
Even on a 270hp car Frank ? At leat I think the same uprated intercooler should be tested on two cars , one with more boost just to see .
It’s a matter of fin density and size… The hot air has to spend time in the core to transfer its heat, when you add more fins inside you slow down the flow, slowing down the flow creates a boost pressure drop on the discharge side…as does a larger internal mass core…
All cores have a pressure drop rating and mass air flow rating…Go big or go home.
My C/C core has a mas airflow rating for 800 HP.
As I said before test them in a controlled environment of a hub dyno…
Place a scroll fan a set distance from the core and have at it with your pulls set for 20 sec. This will give the cores real heat to play with. Or just set the pulls for sustained load at 6000 rpm.
R$D doesn’t come cheap so have the intercooler manufactures put up the money for the dyno time to see who is King of Kool…
RGS Motorsport in Wellingborough have just take delivery of a new 4 wheel drive dyno from down under. They have spent a huge sum of money to get this. If anyone wants to dyno there cars speak to Gav Harris, he’ll sort you out and he really knows his stuff. He’ll be well up for a “cool of competition”.
So how easy would it be to ditch the oem intercooler and fit a VF side mounted a/a cooler instead?
It would be a matter of buying the manifolds and intercooler… The cooler is on the left side of the engine bay.
Do you need to change the manifolds then? Could you not just mount the cooler and run piping to the existing manifolds?
It seems like it ought to be quite easy, surprised no-one has tried this on a factory car…?
Standard manifold intake is in the right side, so yes you need to swap then out.
Not had a response from Kieth to the comments on what he said yet , I will post as soon as I get anything , obviously I’m wanting to know myself after paying for the Marston intercooler about why I didn’t work on this test and what further testing will be done .
hello
all the cores are very different and the temperatures during the tests gave surprising results indeed.
but beside the temperature , we do not know what boost pressure we had (or drop) with each IC, and therefore what BHP the engine gave !
in other words : maybe the standard IC had the best outside temperature BUT more boost drop and maybe less bh power !
and so maybe MMC 2 did not have boost drop so even with a few more degres, still giving a good bhp !
(although temperature usually reduce power !! but boost drop also !!)
so a dyno run will give a chance to register the boost after IC as well as real power for each core !
then the efficiency of each IC will give his full results !
A text I got from MMG trying to explain it to me in numpty terms :
" The best thing to do is do a test on a modded car.
The results will be totally different.
The easiest way of trying to explain it is if you imagine a piece of very hot metal and trying to cool it with a cup of water.
The cup of water representing the charge pressure.
If you then increase the size of the piece of metal (as you have done with the internal surface area)
The same cup of water (pressure) will need to be increased to get the same result.
So any uprated intercooler
With a larger internal surface area, weather it be by volume or internal surface area will need extra pressure to see the benefits.
STD cooler has very little internal surface area. "
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Uh WTF kinda BS are they selling… I’m still waiting for the chargecooler come back.
The water is hot not the metal… The metal is the cooling medium. Pure the hot water over a larger cooling surface and it will cool off faster. The internal fins are the cooling surface… But if the water flows too fast over the surface it will not transfer all its heat…Barrel coolers are like this.
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